How Gen Z is Redefining Work: Challenges, Values, and the Future Workforce

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[00:00:24] All right. I want to talk to you for a moment about retaining and developing your workforce. It's hard. Recruiting is hard. Retaining top employees is hard. Then you've got onboarding, payroll, benefits, time, and labor management.

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[00:01:04] Hey, this is William Tincup and Ryan Leary, and you are listening and watching the You Should Know podcast. We've got Jeremy on today. We have a wonderful topic.

[00:01:12] Speaking Gen Z in recruiting. So Jeremy's got some ideas and we've got questions. So Jeremy, would you do us? We do have questions. Would you do us a favor and introduce yourself?

[00:01:24] I'd be happy to. William and Ryan, thank you very much for having me.

[00:01:28] Sure.

[00:01:28] Jeremy Bilsky, I'm the Senior Director and General Manager for Advanced Partners. So who is Advanced Partners?

[00:01:35] Advanced Partners is a financial services company that provides working capital and strategic services to temporary staffing firms all throughout the United States and even a handful in Canada.

[00:01:48] We've been in business for 26 years and I've had the privilege of being here for just over 20 myself, helping companies of all different shapes and sizes from startups to mid-sized firms to behemoths doing several hundred million in annual sales.

[00:02:05] So we've really kind of run the gamut through our time in business, seeing businesses in different cycles and in a variety of verticals from healthcare to IT to light industrial, clerical, accounting, finance, legal, really seeing lots of different perspectives.

[00:02:26] And as I like to tell people that when they start working here, I've been here 20 years, I've never worked for a staffing firm, but vicariously I kind of have worked with thousands of clients over the years, which is fun.

[00:02:41] And it's nice to share what we've been able to learn over the years in forums like this.

[00:02:47] Is one of your products a factoring?

[00:02:51] It is.

[00:02:52] It's receivables financing.

[00:02:54] As you guys both know all very well, cash flow is a challenge.

[00:02:59] It's a cash flow negative business model.

[00:03:02] The more you grow, the more your profit sitting there in your AR waiting to be unleashed in payments.

[00:03:11] And you've got to make payroll generally every week or every other week.

[00:03:14] And that's why we exist.

[00:03:16] That's how we came together in 1998 to try to address that challenge.

[00:03:21] We weren't the first ones to do it, but we think we're the best that does it.

[00:03:26] And it's an acute need in the industry that isn't going away.

[00:03:33] And, you know, we don't expect it to, and we're happy to answer the bell.

[00:03:38] The need for cash will never go away, especially in staffing.

[00:03:42] But, Jeremy, I'm going to, I'm not a mathematician here.

[00:03:46] Definitely not a professor or anything like that.

[00:03:48] But you've been there for 20 years.

[00:03:51] I'm guessing you're not Gen Z at this point.

[00:03:55] Right?

[00:03:56] I am not Doogie Howser.

[00:03:58] I'm not a prodigy.

[00:04:00] I did not graduate any of my educational levels.

[00:04:04] Yeah.

[00:04:05] I'm not Gen Z.

[00:04:06] The fact that you mentioned Doogie Howser tells me you're definitely not Gen Z.

[00:04:11] That's right.

[00:04:12] Gen Z.

[00:04:12] Although I will pull it up on demand today because that was a hell of a series.

[00:04:17] It was.

[00:04:18] Where do you want to start, Ryan?

[00:04:19] Where do you want to start with Gen Z?

[00:04:21] Let's define Gen Z.

[00:04:23] Yeah, let's define Gen Z because I know there's, it's all relative in that same area of timeframe.

[00:04:28] But let's define Gen Z for the audience and then we're going to start jumping in and name.

[00:04:34] I was going to say crushing.

[00:04:36] I'll hesitate.

[00:04:37] I'll say talking about how we talk Gen Z.

[00:04:40] That's us.

[00:04:43] Well, I think that obviously there's the categorization by years.

[00:04:49] But I, I, I think of when I hear Gen Z and I think of who I've encountered over the years.

[00:04:57] And now I think that there's actually, there's pre pandemic Gen Z and then there's post pandemic Gen Z.

[00:05:06] We're all, we're all changed.

[00:05:08] We're all changed because of the pandemic, but I don't know if anybody is more changed than, than our Gen Z friends.

[00:05:15] Because, you know, chiseled old veterans, you know, like us, we had, we had a lot of work experience and life experience prior to the pandemic where I actually think that I'm guessing we're roughly around the same age.

[00:05:31] We were, we were, we were impacted less.

[00:05:34] People in our, our sphere, the Gen Xers.

[00:05:37] We were impacted much less than, than Gen Z or actually go to the other, the other end of the spectrum to the, the older folks, you know, the, the boomers who were thinking about jumping off ship and retiring.

[00:05:50] And then like, well, they didn't know, they didn't know if there was any, you know, if they were on dry land or not.

[00:05:55] So I think, I think that the, to talk about Gen Z, I think you need to talk about what, what experiences have been like for them before the pandemic.

[00:06:06] And then after, because the, the post pandemic Gen Zers are, are much more concerned about things that, that Gen Xers weren't interested in and still probably aren't.

[00:06:20] And, and probably same with the boomers.

[00:06:23] And this is the, this is the, the generation that's now providing current and future leaders for all of our industries staffing and, and really beyond.

[00:06:35] And they care about things that are different from what we were, we were born and raised on.

[00:06:42] And I'm not here to litigate it and say that anybody is right or wrong.

[00:06:45] It doesn't actually really even matter.

[00:06:47] It doesn't matter.

[00:06:48] We just need to figure out what, what makes all of us tick and then try to leverage that to the point where we can, we can maintain and retain a viable workforce that can get things done.

[00:07:03] And it's a huge challenge that we have in this country.

[00:07:05] We already have a work, a working, a pool of workers that is insufficient to meet the demands of what work needs to get done.

[00:07:17] And is, is this, is this passing?

[00:07:19] Very sensitive to this.

[00:07:21] Is, is the passing of the baton from, from we'll say from X to Z different or any different than boomers passing it down to, to Xers?

[00:07:33] Well, you've skipped millennials, but.

[00:07:35] Or millennials, I did, I did, I did.

[00:07:37] Yeah.

[00:07:38] We'll just jump over them.

[00:07:40] Wow.

[00:07:41] Although there's a lot, although there's a lot of hate for millennials.

[00:07:44] There are.

[00:07:45] For George and Z, which is fantastic.

[00:07:48] Yeah.

[00:07:48] I, I think that, I think that there is a difference because the availability to information when, when us Gen Xers were coming into the workforce was, was very different.

[00:08:02] If you wanted to read something, you're going to library.

[00:08:05] Yeah.

[00:08:05] You know, and, and, and you were reading dated material.

[00:08:09] Right.

[00:08:09] Unless you were.

[00:08:10] And transparency and the whole thing.

[00:08:12] Copy card.

[00:08:12] Right.

[00:08:13] Yeah.

[00:08:14] You know, micro fees.

[00:08:15] Remember that?

[00:08:16] So, um, kind of messy.

[00:08:19] Um, we, I think we were, um, we were less enlightened.

[00:08:24] I think we were more obedient.

[00:08:26] I think we were, we were less likely to question the status quo.

[00:08:31] A hundred percent.

[00:08:32] We were just, we just rolling with the punches.

[00:08:34] Hey, I'm doing what my parents did, you know, or what they told me to do.

[00:08:37] Right.

[00:08:37] Most of the time, not all the time, but most of the time.

[00:08:39] Um, and, and I think that that's how people were more likely to roll.

[00:08:44] I'm not saying that there weren't, you know, rebels amongst us, of course.

[00:08:47] Sure.

[00:08:48] But by and large, I don't think that we had, I don't think we knew what was out there.

[00:08:52] Um, the world was a much smaller place information traveled differently.

[00:08:57] And now you can ruin someone's reputation with the, you know, the click of a tweet.

[00:09:03] Um, we didn't have that.

[00:09:04] So, so the, I think this is more an age of enlightenment and we could, you know, talk about the downsides of it too, but we don't have enough time for that.

[00:09:13] I think that it's broadened this generation's horizons to other lines of thinking and now actually experiencing working in this environment.

[00:09:23] Some, some for the first time joining the workforce saying, Hey, um, I, I care about the, the social responsibility of what we're doing.

[00:09:33] I, it's important that the work that I do makes a difference or I don't necessarily want to work 40 hours a week because there's more to life.

[00:09:41] Live to work.

[00:09:42] I work to live.

[00:09:43] Um, and you've got these, Jeremy, you've got these polarities because I, we absolutely agree with what you, what you're saying.

[00:09:50] Yeah.

[00:09:50] But you've got like tractor supply, John Deere, Microsoft, all getting rid of their DEI programs.

[00:09:57] And, uh, SHRM, the, uh, organization for HR deleting equity and just going with IND, uh, inclusion and diversity.

[00:10:05] And so it's like, it's really interesting to see, I think that's, that's more Gen X and probably even responsive to some customer bases and, and, uh, maybe, maybe placating to, uh, people that, that, uh, that feel a certain way about DEI.

[00:10:22] But then you've got an entire audience, you've got an entire group of people that care about the climate, climate change, care about equity and things like that.

[00:10:32] So it's like at one point, something's got to give between these two forces, if you will.

[00:10:38] Yes.

[00:10:39] Yeah.

[00:10:39] And I, and I think that, um, it's a little bit uncomfortable for me to say it, but I'm going to say it anyway.

[00:10:46] I think we as employers are, are, um, backpedaling a little bit.

[00:10:51] I think that we're, I don't think that we're coming from a position of strength.

[00:10:55] Um, and I'm not saying that I'm not saying that.

[00:10:59] I want to take a break real quick, just to let you know about a new show.

[00:11:03] We've just added to the network up next at work hosted by Gene and Kate Akil of the Devon group.

[00:11:11] Fantastic show.

[00:11:12] If you're looking for something that pushes the norm, pushes the boundaries, has some really spirited conversations.

[00:11:20] Google up next at work, Gene and Kate Akil from the Devon group.

[00:11:27] The playing field should be equal.

[00:11:28] There should be equity between employer employees.

[00:11:30] I'm, you know, the, no one, no one should have an advantage.

[00:11:34] We should be equals.

[00:11:35] I truly believe that.

[00:11:36] And that might be slightly idealistic.

[00:11:38] And, you know, some of your listeners might say, this guy's crazy.

[00:11:41] He's, you know, he doesn't know what he's talking about.

[00:11:42] Maybe I don't.

[00:11:43] But I think that the pendulum has really shifted to being so pro employee.

[00:11:49] And it's been this way for such an extended period of time.

[00:11:52] Mm-hmm.

[00:11:54] Really, really.

[00:11:55] The last almost really about four years, because when hiring picked up post when the pandemic was just on the front end.

[00:12:03] Right.

[00:12:04] In staffing, for example.

[00:12:05] Staffing lost 30% of its employees like that.

[00:12:10] Immediately.

[00:12:11] Yeah.

[00:12:11] Right.

[00:12:12] Faster than you could say William Tin Cup.

[00:12:14] But it came back quickly.

[00:12:16] And it came back quickly in an environment where we don't, again, I'm not going to rehash all of the, all of the stuff that was 2020 and early 21.

[00:12:24] But people's habits changed.

[00:12:27] Their desires changed.

[00:12:29] They were exposed to things that they weren't exposed before.

[00:12:33] Working from home, working sporadically.

[00:12:36] Exactly.

[00:12:37] And this was on the heels of the, of the wave of the gig economy too, which, you know, didn't really take a break.

[00:12:44] It did not take a break.

[00:12:46] Like, and you have, you have fewer W-2 workers right now.

[00:12:50] You have more 1099s.

[00:12:52] You have lots of people that still, you know, are, are not working.

[00:12:57] You have the childcare crisis.

[00:12:59] You have fewer women working because, unfortunately, they're typically more impacted by, by the childcare expense.

[00:13:08] And net of childcare expenses, it doesn't make sense for a lot of families to have two working parents.

[00:13:16] Right.

[00:13:16] Well, it's not even doable.

[00:13:18] Right.

[00:13:19] It's not.

[00:13:19] No, it's untenable.

[00:13:20] It's, that's, that's a huge problem that I think is starting to get some more attention.

[00:13:25] But, but when you, when you add that into the, to the mix.

[00:13:29] Oh, and, and birth rates are down too, which obviously, you know, I have teenagers, you know, like, I feel like they were, you know, they were toddlers a week ago.

[00:13:38] But the workforce that they're going to join in the next five to 10 years is going to be, they're going to be fewer of them joining because the birth rate thing didn't start recently.

[00:13:50] But when you factor in inflation, the tail from inflation and the cost of having families and college and all that, it's there, there's going to be a ripple effect.

[00:14:01] I mean, we've already seen it.

[00:14:02] We've already seen it.

[00:14:04] And the scarcity of workers is profound.

[00:14:07] And so let me, let me ask you this.

[00:14:10] Let me ask a question to Jeremy.

[00:14:11] Yeah.

[00:14:13] So with, so you made mention to employees coming back in force, almost putting or not almost, but putting employers at a disadvantage coming from a more defensive perspective in terms of hiring.

[00:14:29] Because they're forced to change because they're forced to accommodate all of these different types of workers now and these different demands.

[00:14:40] And I feel, I should ask you, is that creating a, almost an insincerity on the employer's part?

[00:14:48] Sure.

[00:14:49] We're going to take up causes.

[00:14:51] We're going to support causes.

[00:14:52] We're going to put money behind things because, well, we have to, or we can't be in business.

[00:14:57] But it's insincere.

[00:14:58] And at what point does that just collide?

[00:15:00] So you can't recruit, you can't recruit talent.

[00:15:02] So you're going to care about climate change.

[00:15:04] We're going to care about climate change.

[00:15:06] Right.

[00:15:06] Yeah.

[00:15:07] But then at what point does that just hit the wall anyway?

[00:15:09] And you're done it now.

[00:15:11] I think that's, I think that's why the companies that are pulling back out of DAI, they never really wanted to do, they never really wanted to do DAI.

[00:15:19] Right.

[00:15:19] Well, or if they did, they're facing harsh repercussions for it because, because of, I know, I know we should, we should, we should be a lot of money.

[00:15:28] We should avoid politics here with the 30 foot goal.

[00:15:31] No, it's part of it.

[00:15:31] But we can, we, I feel like it's fair game to talk about the consequences of the political environment being what it is.

[00:15:37] Sure.

[00:15:37] Ryan, to your point about sincerity or insincerity, what may have been initial sincerity turned into insincerity because of the backlash, because of the, because of the repercussions.

[00:15:47] You know, I don't want to buy from a company that supports X.

[00:15:52] Right.

[00:15:52] Like this is a waste of my time.

[00:15:53] It's, it's, I just want to go buy the product and not have to worry about, you know, what they stand for.

[00:16:00] Why do they have to stand for anything?

[00:16:01] So, so, and there's only so many causes that are apolitical that a, that a company, any company can support.

[00:16:10] Um, you know, I'm not sure any causes apolitical.

[00:16:13] I, I, the only, I mean, I mean, even something like SPCA, it's like, okay, Hey, we're going to help with this.

[00:16:19] I can see some people going, I don't care about animals.

[00:16:22] Yeah.

[00:16:23] Yeah.

[00:16:23] Next.

[00:16:24] Like I'd rather have the money.

[00:16:26] How about, how about, how about, um, how about a community that's been ravaged by a hurricane?

[00:16:31] Uh, so the red cross draws up money and you can't, you can't go more than two minutes without somebody saying, well, is it a red state or a blue state?

[00:16:40] Like who cares?

[00:16:41] That's right.

[00:16:42] There's people that don't have a house anymore.

[00:16:44] Just help them.

[00:16:44] Yeah.

[00:16:45] They don't have water.

[00:16:47] Right.

[00:16:47] But this is the, this is, and if you're on the wrong side of that, then you're going to make somebody mad.

[00:16:52] It's, it's really, it's, it's an untenable standard that, that honestly, I think we're all being held to, but particularly employers because they didn't go to, they didn't go to, into business to stand for, you know, this or that.

[00:17:10] They, they came into business because they have a compelling product to sell and, and if they were, if they're good at it, they stuck around and then they made a name for themselves and they branded to it.

[00:17:19] And, and then, and then there's all these other expectations held to them.

[00:17:23] And I'm not saying it's right or wrong.

[00:17:25] It just is.

[00:17:26] It's, it's a, it's a by-product of the environment that we, we all live in right now.

[00:17:31] What's fascinating is Gen Z in particular, the, one of the first generations to basically point that stuff out and hold our feet to the fire in the sense of, Hey, um, yeah, I won't work with you unless you're this way, whatever that way is, it doesn't really make a difference.

[00:17:50] It's, but the idea again is, uh, as Gen X, I didn't care if I, if I went to, you know, auto zone, they sold car parts.

[00:18:01] I sold car parts for them.

[00:18:03] My stock shelves.

[00:18:04] Do they have this part?

[00:18:06] I just need this part.

[00:18:07] That's all I need.

[00:18:08] I don't care whether or not they donate to this or whether or not it's this, but to your point about the difference between Gen X and Gen Z, Gen X, we were, I'd say, uh, I get not.

[00:18:20] We were enlightened maybe as much as we thought we were.

[00:18:24] And now Gen Z, they won't take jobs.

[00:18:27] They will look at a job and go, okay, I love the job.

[00:18:31] Uh, I can do the job.

[00:18:32] I have the skills, et cetera, et cetera.

[00:18:34] What's your stance on this, this, this, this, and this.

[00:18:37] And if it's not in alignment, it doesn't have to be total alignment, but if it's not in somewhat of alignment, it's like, yeah, no, I'm good.

[00:18:45] And just take my name out of the hat.

[00:18:46] Yeah, I do interest working for a company that cares about, you know, whatever the issue is.

[00:18:51] And their issues change, uh, from day to day and from cause to cause.

[00:18:57] Yeah.

[00:18:57] And hearing you describe that, it really makes me think about there's, there's a continuum of, I'm willing to say this, at least for myself.

[00:19:05] We were somewhat ignorant.

[00:19:06] Yeah.

[00:19:07] And a hundred percent.

[00:19:08] And if there's such a thing as being.

[00:19:10] Blissfully so.

[00:19:11] Okay.

[00:19:11] Blissfully so.

[00:19:12] Right.

[00:19:12] I love the eighties.

[00:19:14] They're great.

[00:19:16] And now, and now you have an overabundance of information.

[00:19:20] Yes.

[00:19:21] And I'm not saying that the gen, the, the, the Gen Z mentality is wrong.

[00:19:26] It's just, there's.

[00:19:27] It's different.

[00:19:28] It's just adding a litany of additional factors to decisions that may or may not be relevant to.

[00:19:35] Hey, is this a good place for me to work?

[00:19:38] This is a great place for me to go, to go saddle my wagon to, to, to build a career.

[00:19:43] Ryan, this is for you as well, because you, you started in recruiting.

[00:19:47] Do you think we're recruiters are up for that task?

[00:19:49] Cause they're used to just selling the job.

[00:19:52] The, you know, the job description, the job, maybe a little bit of the company, but more about the job.

[00:19:58] Do you think recruiters are up to sell?

[00:20:01] Cause that's what they're going to have to do.

[00:20:02] They're going to have to sell the policies and procedures and the values of the company as well as the job description.

[00:20:12] So Jeremy, you both, you'll answer, but what do you, do you think they're up for the task?

[00:20:16] For me?

[00:20:17] Honestly, I think it depends on who the recruiter is and where they come from.

[00:20:21] If I'm recruiting, yeah, I'm probably going to have trouble with that.

[00:20:25] I can adapt, right?

[00:20:27] Cause I need a job.

[00:20:29] But if a recruiter is coming in and they grew up in this environment, no, they're going to be able to.

[00:20:37] I couldn't do, it would be totally insincere for me.

[00:20:40] Yeah.

[00:20:41] I would, I could do it because I need a job.

[00:20:44] However.

[00:20:45] Fair.

[00:20:45] Yeah.

[00:20:45] But if, if, if one of our kids were doing it, no, they would get it.

[00:20:49] They'd understand it and they'd be able to, they, they wouldn't work for the company if they truly didn't believe in the company.

[00:20:55] Well, I've got one kid that would not care because he's so far into the military.

[00:21:00] And then one kid that would probably care too much.

[00:21:02] So I've got the spectrum.

[00:21:04] Yeah.

[00:21:05] But Jeremy, you see this day in, day out.

[00:21:07] Do you think recruiters do they need to be, is it training?

[00:21:10] Is it awareness?

[00:21:12] Like what, what's going to make them better to then deal with the audience has shifted.

[00:21:16] Okay.

[00:21:17] We can argue over how and why and all that other stuff.

[00:21:19] Great.

[00:21:20] Fantastic.

[00:21:20] But the audience, i.e.

[00:21:21] Candidates, Gen Z is candidates.

[00:21:23] The audience has shifted.

[00:21:25] Oh my goodness.

[00:21:27] Bad touching, harassment, sex, violence, fraud, threats, all things that could have been avoided.

[00:21:38] If you had Fama.

[00:21:41] Stop hiring dangerous people.

[00:21:44] Fama.io.

[00:21:47] Hey, what's going on everyone?

[00:21:49] Ryan Leary here from work defined.

[00:21:51] You know, if there was one thing that I could change about recruiting, it would probably be the amazingly awful candidate experience that job seekers have to endure at one of the most stressful times in their life.

[00:22:07] Hiring teams.

[00:22:08] It is time to step up.

[00:22:10] You've got to create an experience that is memorable, fast and efficient.

[00:22:15] And you can do that with Indeed Smart Sourcing.

[00:22:19] Check them out online at Indeed.com or just Google Indeed Smart Sourcing.

[00:22:24] How do recruiters shift with them or hiring managers shift with them?

[00:22:29] I think there's some degree of absorption that they need to have, which I think they were doing before.

[00:22:36] I think a good recruiter knows the, you know, the, they know the audience.

[00:22:43] They know what's successful.

[00:22:44] They can play the game.

[00:22:45] They can play the game.

[00:22:48] If they're successful at it, they play it well because you're a successful recruiter if you put wins on the board.

[00:22:55] You find talent.

[00:22:56] You get people hired.

[00:22:57] So I think, I think it's just, I think it's just heightened awareness and really, and maybe, maybe leaving some of their personal opinions at the door.

[00:23:08] And I don't know.

[00:23:09] I, as I say that, I, I feel like I'm, I'm touting disingenuous behavior, but I think that, I think that it's, I think that it's, you called me on it.

[00:23:19] Thank you.

[00:23:20] Thanks, Ryan.

[00:23:21] But I think, hey, here's, here's how I'll, I'll, I'll soften a little bit.

[00:23:26] But it's developing a muscle group that, you know, doesn't, didn't really exist before.

[00:23:30] Right.

[00:23:31] Which ultimately is going to make, make a recruiter better at their job.

[00:23:35] Yeah.

[00:23:36] And, and keeping up with, with the times because.

[00:23:38] They've never had to believe.

[00:23:40] I mean, going back for a hundred years, they've never had to believe what the candidate believes in.

[00:23:44] So it's never, it's never like we have to believe the same thing.

[00:23:47] And then now my job is to help you get on with this company.

[00:23:50] That's, that's never been there.

[00:23:51] It's just more exposed now.

[00:23:54] So as a recruiter, it's like, keep your opinions.

[00:23:57] You can have strong opinions one way or another, but you're still trying to get placements.

[00:24:01] You're trying to get those wins, right?

[00:24:04] For your client, you're trying to get those, enough of those candidates, get them in there, get a hiring manager to fall in love with one of them and get a placement.

[00:24:11] I think it, I also think that it's, there needs to be more substance into the recruiting.

[00:24:18] The recruiting, the recruiter has to really sell more.

[00:24:22] And this might be a lousy example, but when I was, when I was in college in the nineties, recruiters would come on campus for interviews with candidates.

[00:24:31] And then, you know, what were they doing?

[00:24:34] They were taking everybody out and showing them a good time at night and picking, picking up the bar tabs.

[00:24:38] And that, it was more, it was right.

[00:24:42] Exactly.

[00:24:42] It was more memorable to the candidates that so-and-so from so-and-so company, which I won't mention here.

[00:24:48] Is this where you guys ended up on the ferry?

[00:24:53] Leaving like where all this came from?

[00:24:56] It was a college.

[00:24:58] Yeah.

[00:24:58] Is it Bain or BCG came to the business school and we had like a mixer.

[00:25:03] And then they said, Hey, listen, this has been great.

[00:25:05] We love getting to know y'all.

[00:25:07] We're going to, we're going to take this to the next place.

[00:25:10] Y'all don't have to, you know, whatever you're going to do.

[00:25:12] You want a job.

[00:25:13] No pressure.

[00:25:15] You know, it might've been kept Jim and I can't remember the firm now.

[00:25:18] You don't have to, but we're going to go to this other place and we're just going to be there.

[00:25:22] There's a bunch of senior partners and like everyone's just pounding alcohol and just like, it was great conversations too, because you did kind of get to know the partners.

[00:25:32] As well as kind of the job.

[00:25:34] Like here's the job.

[00:25:35] This is the job job.

[00:25:36] This is what we do.

[00:25:37] So let me, let me ask you guys.

[00:25:39] It's just a different form of recruiting.

[00:25:40] Yeah.

[00:25:41] Let me, let me, let me ask you guys this.

[00:25:43] And I, and I say this with sincerity.

[00:25:46] Are we, would this be the situation where there are three men sitting here talking about and discussing the younger generations?

[00:25:56] Are we the problem?

[00:25:58] Hey, this is William Tinca work to find.

[00:26:01] Hey, listen, I'd like to talk to you a little bit about inside the C-suite, the podcast.

[00:26:05] It's a look into the journey of how one goes from high school, college, whatever, all the way to the C-suite, all the ups and downs, failure, successes, all that stuff.

[00:26:15] Good.

[00:26:15] Listen, subscribe, wherever you get your podcast.

[00:26:18] Like, are we the problem in the workplace saying, well, this is how we have to talk to these youngsters?

[00:26:24] Like, is it, is it time to just transition and move on?

[00:26:29] Well, they have, they have voices too, right?

[00:26:32] I mean, there's great podcasts and great blogs and great, all kinds of, you know, TikTok influencers, YouTube influencers that talk about Gen Z.

[00:26:40] So it's not like, okay, in a vacuum, there's three Gen X people talking about this group of people.

[00:26:47] That's not, well, no, that's not the case, right?

[00:26:50] So they've got great voices to listen.

[00:26:53] There's more than us.

[00:26:54] There's, you know, but they've got influencers.

[00:26:56] They got, they got people they can reach out to and listen to and consume content from to understand kind of how the game is played.

[00:27:04] But for us to talk about it, it's like also for our audience to understand the game is fundamentally different.

[00:27:10] And I think, I think where Jeremy started the conversation with COVID and saying, hey, these kids, they didn't have proms.

[00:27:16] They didn't go to graduations.

[00:27:18] They had to go to school differently.

[00:27:19] They had virtual school, like their life.

[00:27:22] That was their 9-11.

[00:27:23] Yeah.

[00:27:24] Yeah.

[00:27:24] Which was, by the way.

[00:27:26] Yeah.

[00:27:27] Yeah.

[00:27:27] By the way, Jeremy, that was fantastic.

[00:27:30] Big explanation to start off with because I've, although I think we think about it that way, William, we don't actually voice it that way.

[00:27:40] No.

[00:27:40] Pre-pandemic.

[00:27:41] I mean, in my mind, because I live it with the kids.

[00:27:44] Like I've seen it, like they're in my house.

[00:27:46] Yep.

[00:27:46] But I don't, I always say, oh, the pandemic affected them this way, but I never really separated them like that.

[00:27:54] And I think that's key.

[00:27:55] Jobs before and jobs after.

[00:27:57] After candidates before, candidates after.

[00:27:59] Yeah.

[00:27:59] They were impacted in such a way that their lives were forever changed.

[00:28:05] Just like our lives with 9-11.

[00:28:07] Just like our lives were forever changed.

[00:28:09] Like I remember at DFW, not at DFW, at Love Field in Dallas, I could drive, pull up, right in front of the airport, leave my car on the curb, go into the terminal, and go into the gate.

[00:28:22] And like, welcome the person, whoever I was picking up, welcome them at the gate.

[00:28:26] Hey, man, good to hear you.

[00:28:28] Come on, let's go.

[00:28:29] Cars parked out in front of the airport.

[00:28:31] Not anymore.

[00:28:32] Yeah, that's, yeah, well, it's safer now.

[00:28:36] So I don't hate that.

[00:28:38] Yeah.

[00:28:38] However, we'll never forget.

[00:28:40] There's no way that we can ever kind of get that moment out of our minds.

[00:28:44] And for them, COVID, there's a life probably for a lot of the older Gen Z that there was pre-COVID.

[00:28:51] Like they can remember pre-COVID school and then post-COVID.

[00:28:56] And so like that is forever changed.

[00:28:58] But I think it also has impacted what they care about.

[00:29:02] But I think what we're also dealing with is the social channels that they consume, Discord and TikTok and YouTube in particular.

[00:29:11] Where they're consuming content at such a rate.

[00:29:14] Like they're looking, all of our kids, all of our kids, those that are Gen Z and some of those that are alpha.

[00:29:22] They're watching things at 1.5x or two times the speed on YouTube.

[00:29:28] All the time.

[00:29:28] Or on any player.

[00:29:30] Like that's just, that's normal.

[00:29:32] Like I remember I was watching a comedian the other day.

[00:29:35] One of my sons came in and I kind of sat down and watched the comedian with her.

[00:29:38] He was like, can you speed this up?

[00:29:43] They've listened to music.

[00:29:44] Like one of my only have playlists, the sped up versions.

[00:29:49] They don't even listen to music at the same level.

[00:29:52] Yeah.

[00:29:52] Oh, yeah.

[00:29:53] And some of the sped up versions are better.

[00:29:55] I'm not going to lie.

[00:29:56] He sat right next to me.

[00:29:58] He's like, can you speed this shit up?

[00:29:59] I'm like, well, what do you mean?

[00:30:02] He's like, well, dad, just hover over the thing.

[00:30:04] Now put it on two.

[00:30:05] I'm like, I did that.

[00:30:06] And it was like, I was like, you know what?

[00:30:08] This is actually better.

[00:30:12] Because there's a lot of space in comedy.

[00:30:14] That's hilarious.

[00:30:14] They'll tell a joke and then there's space.

[00:30:17] It's like he kills all that space.

[00:30:18] Yeah.

[00:30:19] I want to answer Ryan's question.

[00:30:23] Are we the problem?

[00:30:24] Who?

[00:30:25] I think we could be.

[00:30:26] But I think we need to ask ourselves that question.

[00:30:30] Yeah.

[00:30:31] Especially when we're having a hard time hiring people.

[00:30:34] Yeah.

[00:30:34] And I think we need to have the mindset of, okay, we need to avoid being the problem.

[00:30:39] We have to make sure that we're not so set in our ways that we're rolling our eyes at what

[00:30:45] we might find to be trivial, just nonsense.

[00:30:51] And I'm not saying that it is, but there might be some things that are a little strange to

[00:30:55] us.

[00:30:55] Yeah.

[00:30:56] Because there's just so far a feel like we're not, you're talking about something that,

[00:31:00] you know, maybe about the environment or about, you know, policy decisions that have

[00:31:05] really nothing to do with your job.

[00:31:06] But if that's important to the candidate pool, then we have to consider that.

[00:31:10] And maybe, maybe we don't do anything about it, but we, we at least owe it to ourselves

[00:31:15] and the candidates to at least give consideration to it.

[00:31:18] And, you know, and just figure out that balance because, you know, we want to stay on the trajectory

[00:31:25] that we're on, but sometimes you got to pivot.

[00:31:29] And you've given us a really good trigger in, in, uh, in a sense of if you feel as a

[00:31:35] recruiter or hiring manager, if you feel your eyes are about to roll in your head, you have

[00:31:40] to ask yourself, is that a you thing?

[00:31:42] Right.

[00:31:43] Right.

[00:31:43] Or them.

[00:31:44] Yeah.

[00:31:45] Right.

[00:31:45] Is that a, is that a use?

[00:31:46] It looks like, okay, someone says that they're really, really interested in women in leadership.

[00:31:51] And so yeah, job, job, totally get it.

[00:31:53] Got the skills.

[00:31:54] I can do the job, but I'm really interested in women in leadership.

[00:31:57] And it looks like it's a bunch of, it's a sausage factory.

[00:32:00] So like, what's the plan?

[00:32:02] Right.

[00:32:02] Okay.

[00:32:02] And if you're feeling yourself about to roll your eyes, it's a, it's a you thing.

[00:32:08] Okay.

[00:32:08] Fair enough.

[00:32:09] Yeah.

[00:32:09] And, and, and if you hear it once, you're probably not going to, you're probably in all

[00:32:13] likelihood going to hear it again.

[00:32:14] Like you're, you're going to hear, right.

[00:32:16] You know, so, so that, that desire to roll the eyes, you know, just don't do it.

[00:32:22] Like don't.

[00:32:23] Yeah.

[00:32:24] And because you're probably going to hear something like it again.

[00:32:28] And again, and again, and before you know it, Oh, well then it's going to be in your,

[00:32:32] you know, in your hiring manual to look out for this or that before you know it.

[00:32:38] So I'd rather, I'd rather be on the, on the forefront of knowing that something is meaningful

[00:32:44] to the candidate pool before it's, you know, before it's written down and just, you know,

[00:32:50] right.

[00:32:50] It's like a, it's like a cornerback guarding a wide receiver.

[00:32:53] You got to stay on the balls of your feet.

[00:32:54] You got it.

[00:32:55] I think it's part of the agility that we all need to have.

[00:32:57] Just be prepared.

[00:32:59] Don't be surprised at anything.

[00:33:00] You know, the, the amount of things that are swirling around people's heads right now,

[00:33:05] you, William, you just referred to the amount of content that is in front of all of us, but

[00:33:09] particularly the Gen Zers who don't remember life without, without social media.

[00:33:15] They, this is part of their being.

[00:33:18] And we need to just recognize that and, and not be cynical, which is, which is hard.

[00:33:25] Drops mic, walks off stage.

[00:33:27] Jeremy, thank you so much for coming on the show.

[00:33:29] This has been fantastic.

[00:33:30] We'll have you back.

[00:33:31] We'll tackle another topic next time, but this has been great.

[00:33:34] We really appreciate you.

[00:33:37] Thank you.

[00:33:37] Thank you.

[00:33:38] And thank the audience.

[00:33:39] We'll see y'all next time.