Getting Inclusive AF with Jackye and Katee

[00:00:00] You're listening to Inclusive AF with Jackie Clayton and Katie Van Horn. I have things to say. Jackie has all the things to say. It's Katie and Jackie, Inclusive AF, The Musical. Dun-dun-da-da. We should do that. Just have one episode that's just us singing. I love it.

[00:00:29] Super good singers. For all of those listening, if you didn't know, now you know we're the singer extraordinaire. So Jackie, what is that? Is that your new microphone around your neck? No. It's just on my shirt. It says you're on mute. Oh, okay.

[00:00:45] You have, it looks like it's a necklace though. I thought, okay. So she has a crown that says you're on mute. The way that her necklace is laying on her shirt though, it looks like it is like a microphone that's attached to like her. That was, that's funny.

[00:00:58] I think you're onto something though. I think we should actually invent that. That's a cool idea. But that seems like it would hurt my neck, I think. I don't know if I'd like that to have a necklace microphone. I'm all over it. Okay. I'm just saying. All right.

[00:01:13] Well, listen, we are going to talk about. The EEOC has a class action lawsuit against workday. Listen. This is earth-strattering and out of control. I don't know if this has ever happened. So a little backup, a person was suing it's mobility versus workday.

[00:01:38] So a person decided to sue workday because they said that the software discriminated against people. I believe this guy happened to be a black person, but they were saying that it discriminated against them.

[00:01:53] And so they sued and that case, they like put on hold and they're going to have to revisit. But the EEOC looked at that case and said, you know what? We agree and filed a class action lawsuit.

[00:02:11] And they supported this plaintiff's theory that the AI for a vendor can be liable under Title VII, the ADA for people who have disabilities and employment discrimination because of it. That's huge. They're saying software can be held compliant versus the laws and like trying to make sure

[00:02:39] that they don't sue against people with disabilities. I mean, this is huge. Yeah. Well, and the fact that the EEOC has gotten involved also lets you know that I mean that is lending a huge kind of vote of confidence if you will to the claim as well.

[00:02:55] So that's going to be interesting. And you know, the part that struck me is all of these companies that use AI. I mean, we know that there are a ton of companies that that's actually their claim

[00:03:08] to fame is, hey, we can help you, you know, screen resumes with X, Y and Z and you know, whatever it might be. And as we all know, anytime it's a human made tool AI kind of can get funky and things can go left real quick.

[00:03:27] So well, it's just ugly to think about like so many people and that's been the pitch for AI. Like you don't need will do it for you. And so they're saying, oh, if you're employing this software, then it's your HR you're

[00:03:41] outsourcing your function to an algorithm and a software. And there I dare somebody to try to argue that. Well that's that's I'm wondering like how are they even going like again, the EEOC doesn't get involved with the type of stuff until unless they know they're going to win.

[00:04:01] And you know, it's it's the if they got involved, it's not going to go away anytime soon. And what how many other companies are going to get pulled into this if this does go through

[00:04:13] and if this does become a thing because we know so many people are using these type of tool, whether it's workday or whatever. And I just the whole. Let me give you clarification before people go in there.

[00:04:31] Let me give clarification in case people so when we talked about it, we talked about it started with Mobley versus workday. So in that case, Mobley said that workday engaged in a pattern or practice of discriminatory job screening that disproportionately disqualifies African Americans individuals over 40 and

[00:04:54] individuals with disabilities from securing employment and violation of Title 7. And they said specifically workdays, AI and algorithms are more likely to deny applicants who are black over 30 and have a disability and said that they acted as an employment agency. So that was filed in 2023.

[00:05:15] And so that one they were they dismissed it it's fully briefed, but it doesn't mean that it's done because it wasn't until April 2024 when the EEOC decided to file back and say that they thought that they had that piece that it was inappropriately partisan.

[00:05:37] And so the EEOC is doing on behalf of Mobley. Can you imagine like they're selling a software company, the local judge in California? It's like, no, I don't think so. And the EEOC is like really because we think so. Wow. Right.

[00:05:52] Well, and that's the thing is like, you know, this whole is their bias in your algorithm conversation. You know, I mean, we've heard about it with everything that we're seeing and we're, you know, I think people are trying to make AI better, you know, even just like chat

[00:06:06] GPT. But it's one of those things that as a vendor, you know, they're not actually the employer. And so how does that like, how does that get applied when it's not like truly at the end of the day, they're not making the decision on hiring or not hiring.

[00:06:22] But if the recruiter isn't even seeing resumes, they're getting auto auto declined or whatever, because they don't have whatever words or language that they're looking for. That's that's just fascinating to me. I don't think it is.

[00:06:37] That's why I was like, wait a minute, because I think about it. I think people think the algorithm like I, you know, low key wish that that it would do that for me. I guess with my most recent role, I had to go through like over 1100 resumes.

[00:06:51] I went through all of those one by one by hand and still got accused of being a robot. But the thing is it's like humans are worse. P.S. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Well, and that's, I guess that might also be like the backup claim, but

[00:07:09] the turn downs, it sounds like, you know, it was like within hours of applying to these different roles. So there's something in the background doing something. So something was doing something. So I, you know, it makes me nervous because how far does it go?

[00:07:25] I understand the executive order. I understand being nervous about, you know, AI and how it works and what we're using it for. I don't think it's cut and dry as they try to make it seem like I

[00:07:37] don't think that anybody purposely is trying to do any of those things. But it brings you to the other question, just like we saw that came out in New York recently, like you have to have a third party checking

[00:07:47] on the software to make sure that you're not biased. At least tell me that you're checking it and tell me that you know. But because a lot of yours is ignorant. Yeah, I don't think that I don't think that people even think about

[00:08:04] it or think about the impact that it might have. And, you know, it's it's just one of those things that, you know, if if this does go further or if this does become an actual case, like,

[00:08:20] you know, obviously it's just at this point, just a just a lawsuit. If this becomes like a real situation, it is like, OK, is the EOC overstepping by saying that this tool, these vendors are liable?

[00:08:39] But I know, like, I mean, we know, like I said, there's so many of these new tools that are coming out that it basically says straight up, you know, we will screen candidates for you with our automated boobity bobbity boop, you know, with their boobity bobbity boop.

[00:08:54] Yeah, you know, like, like Cinderella. Yeah, like Cinderella, like Cinderella can choose. But I mean, Workday is they are having the worst week, you know, like wasn't there a show that used to be like worst week ever? Yeah, Workday is having the worst month ever.

[00:09:13] Well, why? I don't know why else. Why else? What else is going on? Yes. So we have that case. There was an article that was in the business insider that says everybody hates Workday explaining why everybody hates Workday. We also know something else happened.

[00:09:34] It was, you know, like people. I haven't seen people talk so much about one particular software. I haven't seen this since we saw back in the day with higher view when everybody was like, ah, higher view. I haven't seen it in a long time.

[00:09:52] And so many people have been worried about talking about them because they're so huge. And so people haven't been, you know, said they didn't. It's called the most hated workplace, the most hated software on the planet. They're saying that it's biased. What else has happened this past week?

[00:10:18] I mean, if you go and like do a search by Workday and go into news and look in the past week, it isn't it is not pretty. I love that there. So I just pulled up the business insider article and there's a

[00:10:32] quote at the top, getting someone onboarded using Workday is like trying to get water from your sink to your stove using a colander. Wow. That's kind of funny. Well, I guess like I think you and I both have our own.

[00:10:48] So I've I've implemented Workday or was a part of an implementation of Workday at one of my previous employers. And it is not. Not as great as everyone thinks it is. You literally need an entire development team on the employer side

[00:11:08] to get everything working the way you need it to. And unless you have like an internal dev team that's just dedicated to your HRIS tool, which who has headcount for that in HR, you can't actually make it work the way you need it to work.

[00:11:25] So I do find that part interesting that I'm not. I I am a fan from the from the. User experience once it's built. I guess I've never I mean, to be honest, I've never used it. I haven't personally used it. I've just heard all the rumor.

[00:11:46] It's very pretty. It's very pretty. I like pretty things. Yeah. I you know, I think that. They what's interesting is that they were saying that they encourage companies to like people who work at companies and having to work more. What?

[00:12:05] Yeah, because you because it's not there's no like I forget what the expression is that they use that it's not customizable. It's configurable or or maybe I'm saying that backwards. And so it's not like you can't make it work for your specific needs and your specific company.

[00:12:24] So it's just it's like this is it's kind of a off the shelf, you know, out of the box. Option, but everyone thinks it's so pretty that they think it was going to be

[00:12:33] like the Beall end all, you know, that was kind of the way it was touted when it was launched and then it was like actually no, it's not that great. And they were also doing the whole thing, which I know a lot of companies do,

[00:12:47] which, you know, they were kind of building the plane as they were flying it. And so half of the modules are different, like the ATS didn't work. You know, the whatever didn't work. Clearly, ATS still is not working if there is bias in the algorithms to screen

[00:13:02] candidates, but it's just it's fascinating to me that that is it doesn't shock me because I mean, you know, we have quite a few friends. William Tin Cup, I'm looking at you who are not fans of Workday

[00:13:18] and, you know, are definitely on the bandwagon of not not supporting them in any way, shape or form. So the thing is, it's like what also, which is it? Do you want an all in one platform? Do you really I just can't like

[00:13:36] so many people do and that's why people have it. We have to look at what is good. Whatever y'all people can talk trash all day, just like they do about LinkedIn, yet everybody uses it just like they do about sales force.

[00:13:50] Yeah, everybody uses it right and they so people can talk shit all day. It is like the top like HRS system. And I went to their conference. Literally, it was like in three buildings. Oh, yeah. They're ginormous. People are using it. They're making the investment.

[00:14:10] Right. And I mean, they are their stock prices, as you know, isn't suffering from this lawsuit or anything else. They're making their printing money. And I don't think it's going to hurt them directly, because I think they're going to go in and say it's bullshit

[00:14:24] because of the way the way that it's not because people just aren't that smart. They would by mistake hire somebody. He was lacking over 40 because of their name and where they were school. Like the it's just it's just not that smart. But.

[00:14:40] I do think this is going to scare a lot of people into doing the right thing, what they should be doing from the very beginning. So like to be clear, like I'm not saying I don't know anything. I have a used work day.

[00:14:52] I'm not a part of lawsuit, class acting, whatever. But I think it's interesting that we're looking at doing a major player in this space and thinking of how many other tools that's literally their pitch is that, oh, yeah, you can fire half your

[00:15:06] recruiting team and I'll do all the screening for you or the ones that are acting as an agent and making the decision to make your highest decisions. I mean, come on. Right now, like I think even like going through the manual process

[00:15:25] looking for our VP of sales is that I don't know if a company is a startup or not. So it takes me forever to go individually, company by company, to look up if it's a SaaS company, if it's HR tech, if it's B2B sales,

[00:15:39] because I want to be fair, I can't just reject them and say, eh, no company's name. I that doesn't feel like a SaaS startup. That's not a good enough answer. So it takes forever. So I can't imagine feeling like we haven't taught the algorithm of what that

[00:16:01] they're not looking up all those things. We haven't taught them, especially from two years ago, how would you know if a company is set for today? I don't know. I just think that that I think that it's I'm glad that they're looking at it.

[00:16:15] It'll be interesting to see what the impact will have on the overall industry. I don't think long term, it'll have an overall impact on work day at all. Do you love news about LinkedIn, Indeed, Google and just about every other recruitment tech company out there? Hell yeah.

[00:16:30] I'm Chad. I'm Cheese. We're the Chad and Cheese podcast. All the latest recruiting news and insights are on our show. Dripping in snark and attitude. Subscribe today wherever you listen to your podcasts. We out. We'll see. We shall see.

[00:16:47] So I also wanted to talk a little bit about this. The Washington Post actually published an article about DEI getting a new name. And I saw that. Can it can it overcome the baggage that it has, blah, blah, blah?

[00:17:04] And how so many companies, especially public companies that have to prepare an ESG report and set ESG goals. So environmental, social and governance goals that they are taking. They're replacing diversity and really focusing on the word inclusion,

[00:17:24] which like on one hand it kind of does make me chuckle because I'm like, yeah, anyone who's been doing this for any amount of time actually focuses on inclusion first because you know that that's what you have to focus on first.

[00:17:37] But the fact that our companies are saying, oh, we are not going to use that language anymore and we're not going to put it in all of our names and, you know, all of these different things.

[00:17:47] But it is also another attack on how do we keep this work going? And and how do we keep inclusion kind of front of mind as a priority for companies? That's the thing that I worry about is that, you know, is this going to kind of fall off

[00:18:13] fall off people's radar and hopefully it won't. And, you know, I don't want to talk about the Washington Post article very much because someone that we're not really a fan of is quoted in there. Yeah, a lot of times. A lot of times.

[00:18:29] Yeah. And so, you know, I think the piece for me is that, you know, when you think about and to be also to be clear, if there's a lot of very great DEI consultancies that are also quoted in this article, so that's a good part.

[00:18:45] But it is like it just highlights some of the ways that this work is again under attack and, you know, getting. You know, I think the word that was used with, you know, pummeled, you know, that kind of thing, you know, in regards to how we actually

[00:19:02] do this work and how we get this work again to stay front of mind with folks. But it's just another another way. But have you seen or are you all doing anything different from the language that you're using about DEI?

[00:19:21] We have. I don't think we have what I say we have. We just have an over index on it because of we just launched a new product that really talks about your existing workforce. And it really does focus on being fair and making sure everybody's getting adequate feedback.

[00:19:38] But I think that overall, it has been the message of. If we're trying to help people be more inclusive, if we're focusing on inclusion, like we need to get it into as many hands as possible to change.

[00:19:55] I don't want I don't want language to be the reason why somebody doesn't have it. I just also think that. I don't understand why people are trying to control the narrative. It's going to be the same thing. I mean, it's really stupid. You know, I don't.

[00:20:10] Just the thing that organ is that I just don't understand why people are so stupid, Katie, all it's going to take is for me to stew the organization, which will happen for them being discriminatory because it's still against the law.

[00:20:24] It's something major is going to something major is going to happen in order for them to say, oh, we should focus on DEI be. It's not. It's just dumb. OK, so tell everybody that you don't care about DEI be awesome.

[00:20:40] And now I'm going to see for being discriminatory. What are you going to say? No. Like if you like, if you literally want to, you know, cause some mass hysteria, do that. Right. Right. It's just. There's just so much noise around DEI right now.

[00:20:57] And I say noise because I just feel like there's it is the perfect example of how the media manipulates people and objects and how there has to be a some sort of very powerful group that is behind

[00:21:16] some of these things that is just pushing for certain narratives and certain things. I mean, you know, when when you see this type of article from seamlessly a somewhat reputable organization like The Washington Post, you do go, oh, wow, OK, well, wait, what's going on?

[00:21:36] What's this about blah, blah or business insider? As you know, from the article we were talking about earlier. So it is that. Well, no, but is this is something we need to worry about or think about?

[00:21:48] Or is this just noise to distract from what from the work that we're actually trying to do? I think it's just but you have to get more specific. It's noise from this gender hetero like super conservative, like mega church Christian.

[00:22:06] Like it's very, very specific, but also the people that have like the largest amount of money and balance equal of power trying to hold on. Oh, I did it again. If you don't know if you're watching on YouTube, if I raise my hand. It makes a switch.

[00:22:23] If you talk with your hands as I'm sorry. Yeah, I cannot have the reaction. I'm on the reactions on Zoom are getting updated. A little to team. But I mean, that's the that's the challenge and it's just out of desperation

[00:22:40] holding on for as long as you can because you are like five years away from being obsolete. So it makes sense if you really thought that your whole people are going to be eradicated. But you would think in the meantime, you would make better choices to make sure

[00:22:55] that you are being inclusive, that we can all work in a fair and equitable place until you get someplace and there's a shift in power. Then you're going to be fall victim and praise the same laws that you tried to implement in the first place.

[00:23:10] It's yeah, it is like, yeah, what are you trying to achieve? What are you trying to do with whatever you're working on? And, you know, hopefully this isn't going to isn't going to make it even worse. But when you say worse, what do you mean?

[00:23:33] Like it's because companies are backing off or not. Talking about this. Or, you know, maybe deprioritizing it. Or I mean, we know obviously after the murder of George Floyd and Breonna Taylor and some of the other social justice activities, if you will, that occurred a few years ago,

[00:23:56] everyone was watching at home because of covid. And so it was like it became much more real for folks. And now my my concern is there's so much other stuff. I mean, if we could just talk about any topic.

[00:24:11] I mean, Drake and whatever having some sort of beef and writing songs about each other. Like that's coming up on my on the woman that listens to everything I say and turns lights on for me. And so it's that type of stuff that like is just their distractions.

[00:24:30] And you then go, OK, how do we actually get like get cut out some of that fluff? Right. And and actually like come. Come full circle or whatever. And then like because I like for example, like this, I don't know if you are a fan of Yellowstone.

[00:24:57] No, OK, I'm not not a fan. I just didn't watch it. OK. The suspension of disbelief is you have to be really prepared that there's going to be things that are going to happen that you're like,

[00:25:10] this is not any way real because this could never happen in a real situation. But one of the stars, it's actually so they they made like four other kind of spinoffs from this. And one of them was this 1883 and then there was another one.

[00:25:31] I'm going to forget what it was, what year it was that it doesn't matter. But one of the stars who is a Native American, he was found in the woods, murdered or they, you know, it was dead under suspicious circumstances, I'll say.

[00:25:52] And his hair had been cut off, which is like a huge. Like no one would do that in the Native community. And then it came out that this woman that he was friends with or had some interaction

[00:26:06] with actually cut his hair and then two days later, he was found dead in the woods. Then the story evolves to his sister was found dead in the woods six months ago or eight months ago.

[00:26:19] And so and this the kid or he's not a kid, he's an adult, Cole brings plenty. He was very beloved by a lot of people because he was a star in the show. And the police are basically like shutting it down and making it into Oh,

[00:26:37] it wasn't a big deal like he it's suicide. It's you know, let's just shut this case down when there's so much around it. They're like, no, there has to be more to the story.

[00:26:46] And and I'm using that as an example of, you know, we have so many of those types of things happening right now in the world that are like. I won't say cover up, but it's like, oh, we're not going to focus on that.

[00:27:00] Look over here at the stupid thing and, you know, the different folks, folks says that we do keep like Drake and whoever's who is it that's having Kendrick Lamar? I was about to say his he's got a name. He's got a whole name.

[00:27:15] I know I was trying to remember what his name was because that's how much I'm not invested in their beef. I don't like I don't really I'm not very much into the what I'll say, the newer rap generation. I'm I'm I stick with the old school, you know,

[00:27:32] like my boy Snoop, my special friend, Snoop. Well, I have been fully vested in the Drake Kendrick Lamar. I'm a big fan of Kendrick Lamar. But the thing that when you talk about that and you would be, you would be.

[00:27:46] It's what you would be vested if you knew because he came out with a song that is very much in the in the spirit of Snoop dog Kendrick Lamar did. But the thing that was going on with that, it's just like anybody else's beef.

[00:28:04] The thing is we're in a different age in a different decade. It's really funny when someone's like has a disc track and it's like you're not a very good dad because they're not fully present. What? Yeah.

[00:28:18] OK, like that's like that is literally is that what he said or part of it? It's part of it. Yeah, for real. But then like saying like all of the different pieces that have been going in.

[00:28:33] What's interesting to me is that it wasn't just news and fed your algorithm. It was like an NPR, it was like I'm S.N.B.C. It was like in CNN. And the tail is wagging the dog at this point.

[00:28:49] Like I literally this is how bad it is. I literally was told on YouTube there's this new program that can tell you where you're getting your news from taking it article by article to tell you about the author, if it's right or left leaning, the accuracy.

[00:29:04] I was about to like actually buy a product to do that. How sad is it that I can't, you know, like you can use and the stuff that we're getting is a distraction of what's going on

[00:29:15] because it's we're getting a bunch of crap and don't know what's actually going on. Like there's a freak in a whole lawsuit against Donald Trump. I don't understand why I care about Kendrick Lamar and Drake.

[00:29:29] If I don't know what the person who is the like the Republican candidate for president was getting food right now for money. Well, don't worry. You know, so that's the ad that lot or that case is happening right now.

[00:29:44] And Stormy Daniels actually was on the witness stand yesterday. I think she might have been on the witness stand again today. But but don't worry. The judge in Florida. Postponed. Stop right there. Like really his other cases because they they think it's unfair to do it right now

[00:30:01] while he's in a political race. Shut up. Or it's very important for us to have this because we're trying to make a decision on who's going to run the country. Right. Or that or that either or maybe not. I mean, right? One of those is wrong.

[00:30:20] But I mean, I don't I don't know. I I get. I'm terrified just because it's like worse and it's like. I say worse, I don't know what's going to I don't know. Like like I said, it's like the tail is wagging the dog.

[00:30:36] It's going to take people to take a stand. I think we're going to see people who don't want to live with their head in the sand that are going to be making more more choices besides me and Katie.

[00:30:47] We're going to be making those right choices and still being the same. But I think we have to have a very we have to be careful because what is happening is the overall culture in the United States and how you treat your

[00:31:01] workforce, what's important and what we're giving people. And like the productivity is going to be affected. And so what are we going to do with that? Imagine how fast we could solve the world's biggest problems if more SA Startups would gain traction sooner.

[00:31:18] Welcome to the Tech Entrepreneur on the Mission podcast. This podcast is dedicated to sharing experiences from B2B SaaS CEOs who are going above and beyond to deliver chains that is noticed. You will hear their secrets and learn what is required to build a SaaS business

[00:31:34] that the world starts talking about and keeps talking about and how to overcome the roadblocks to do so. I don't know. I mean, because like I like remember back when Trump was elected and then Charlottesville happened and very soon after and it was like

[00:31:56] work was disrupted like majorly. Now, since that time, as we all know, there have been so many just horrific things that have occurred to people from marginalized communities. So it almost has desensitized people in a way.

[00:32:17] So that's the other part that scares me is that if he is reelected, productivity might take it, but it's also we won't be living in a democracy anymore. And so what does that actually mean to the United States? Right.

[00:32:32] You know, I was just traveling as Jackie, you know, as traveling to a couple other countries in Europe a few weeks ago. And the conversation is, you know, how Trump is similar to Putin, how the US like what is going on in the US

[00:32:50] that this is even a topic of conversation. And it's one of those things that it's just it's just ongoing conversations and ongoing things that are distracting employees. But then it's also our employees desensitized to so much of this stuff that is

[00:33:11] no, we need you to be paying attention and we need you to be fighting this and we need you to be voting and all of these things. So I don't know it's there's a lot going on. Well, hopefully, you know, you'll fix it.

[00:33:25] I am going to be like who's going to fix it? It's us that are going to fix it. So hopefully us and our listeners are going to take a bigger. You know, have another opportunity to get fixed because Lord knows there is some need to happen.

[00:33:44] Yeah, somebody needs to fix it right now. Jackie, I do want to share something with the listeners and with you. You might already know this. So Slack has a meme that you can or meme creator, I should say. I don't know if you knew this or not.

[00:34:04] Create your own memes in Slack. And I had a client reach out to me because they said someone created this meme and we have a global team. We don't know how this will be received in Germany specifically. And it was Grammar Nazi.

[00:34:26] And are you talking about and the not and the swastika was the actual picture for the Grammar Nazi? And and I was like, OK, yeah. Well, first, like delete that or whatever you need to do and have your IT team block

[00:34:40] that from your Slack channel so that can't be used. But then it made me think like what how would that be received by folks in Germany? So as you know, I have team members over there.

[00:34:54] So I asked one of them that as a trusted partner, I just said, hey, I want to ask you something. I want to just get your take. How would this be? And she at first was like, I don't what like what does it mean?

[00:35:05] I don't get it because she had no idea what like how those two words kind of came together. And then I explained it to her and she's like, yeah, that's weird. And then when I told her, you know, it's a swastika is the and she was like,

[00:35:18] yeah, that's not great. And like it was very much a yeah, we don't use that word and that's not a word that should be used. So for those of you who have Slack as one of your communication tools,

[00:35:30] please know, especially my HR friends out there that have to monitor some of these things and keep an eye on certain things. There are ways that your team members can create memes that maybe are not as professional or appropriate. And we would like Katie, it's just dumb.

[00:35:49] Yes, exactly. It's just dumb. So anyhow, I just wanted to call that out to folks because I, you know, as we're talking about different things right now, these are the types of things that again, people become desensitized to a word

[00:36:06] that has an extremely heavy meaning to a lot of people around the globe. And so just being aware of some of that stuff, I just want to call it out. I want to call it out to folks. Oh, I appreciate that.

[00:36:21] Yes, I guess I'm getting up because I see Scooby is going to hurt herself and try to come into my office. Scooby-dee-dee-dee. You know, a lot of stuff going on today, Katie. Yes. Yes, it is. So I want to ask you, Jacqueline,

[00:36:39] what is one thing you want our listeners to have heard during this episode? Geez, I don't know. We're doomed. It's all over. Save yourself. Save yourself. Mine is if you haven't built your bomb shelter, now is your time to do it. Become a prep.

[00:37:00] No, I so actually I was reading something and it was completely ridiculous. Well, I shouldn't say it's not completely ridiculous, but slightly ridiculous. And it was literally like make sure you have a battery powered radio that you can

[00:37:16] plug in as well in case power goes out, but like, you know, have that backup generator type thing, make sure you have water, make sure you have all these things. And you think about it and you're like, yeah, that's where we are right now.

[00:37:29] Like at any moment, we could have the next World War. We could have any number of things happening that are not great. And, you know, with that, I want to wrap it up and say thanks, everyone, for listening to our very sad and depressing episode.

[00:37:48] No, I'm just kidding. Sad and depressing. I do I want to take it back. I want what I want people to do is make sure you know what you're getting. Your new sources and just double check and verify. Yeah. Yeah.

[00:38:01] And mine is AI is not the answer to everything. And make sure your could be the answer to a lawsuit, though. It could be the answer to a lawsuit. Yeah. So we're actually talking today, I was talking to one of my managers about

[00:38:17] can I write a performance improvement plan using chat GPT? And I was like, I actually would like you to try and see what it comes up with just because I was curious. And so he said he was going to try.

[00:38:28] So I'll report back during the next episode what I learned from him if it actually worked or not. Chat GPT. All right. This is Katie Van Horn. And this is Jackie Clayton. OK, bye. How much do you understand the future of finance?

[00:38:54] I'm Jim Maruz, a top 10 banking influencer and host of the podcast Banking Transform where we dive deeply into the rapidly evolving world of banking and financial technology. Join me as I interview industry experts, thought leaders and innovators as they unravel the latest banking trends, disruptions and game changing

[00:39:14] technologies reshaping the world of finance. Redefine your understanding of the banking ecosystem. Subscribe now to Banking Transform, available wherever you get your podcast and now available on YouTube.