Empathy and emotional intelligence in HR: Adapting and Pivoting in Your Career with Tiffani Martinez of Otter PR

[00:00:00] I think a job description should both attract and repel.

[00:00:05] Like somebody should read a job description, you go, oh hell no. That's not for me.

[00:00:09] Right.

[00:00:10] And the people that didn't read it go, oh yeah, this is exactly what I've been looking for all my life. Yes.

[00:00:15] So I look at a thousand candidates as historically us being in love with volume,

[00:00:24] but not necessarily putting in the things in our job description or career site, whatever.

[00:00:31] In the things that would repel people.

[00:00:36] Hey, this is William Tincup and Ryan Leary and you are listening and hopefully watching the Practitioners Corner.

[00:00:42] We have Tiffany Martinez on from Outer PR and we're going, which is fascinating on so many levels.

[00:00:49] But we're going to talk about her career, kind of how she got here.

[00:00:53] Some of the things that are important to her both historically and also now.

[00:00:57] So Tiffany, would you do us a favor and introduce yourself?

[00:01:00] Love to. Again, my name is Tiffany.

[00:01:03] I have been with Outer PR now for, I mean my third year and it's been amazing.

[00:01:11] My first startup business that I worked for.

[00:01:14] So that's been a learning curve on a lot of aspects.

[00:01:17] I have a corporate insurance background, but did non-profit for 12 years.

[00:01:24] And HR was only one side of the nonprofit side.

[00:01:27] So I have a lot of different backgrounds.

[00:01:31] True Florida native born, raised and lived in this state my entire life and have no ambition to leave it.

[00:01:38] Is not worth it a cold.

[00:01:43] Are we East Coast Florida?

[00:01:45] No, 12th Coast.

[00:01:47] Yeah.

[00:01:48] Okay.

[00:01:49] Yeah.

[00:01:50] That's all that I like.

[00:01:51] It's all East Coast because it's on the East Coast.

[00:01:53] Okay.

[00:01:54] No, the Gulf.

[00:01:55] I've always had this gripe with people in Florida.

[00:01:58] I'm on the East Coast to Florida.

[00:02:00] I never sat on the West Coast to Pennsylvania.

[00:02:02] I just said Pennsylvania.

[00:02:03] Listen, it can take 10 hours to drive from the keys all the way up to Tallahassee.

[00:02:08] So we are on the East Coast and West Coast just based on our.

[00:02:12] I guess the driving ticket keys is awful.

[00:02:15] Oh, Miami.

[00:02:17] Keep going.

[00:02:18] No, from Philadelphia.

[00:02:19] You just keep going and going and going and you never stop.

[00:02:23] Well, yeah.

[00:02:24] I mean that's a little extreme.

[00:02:26] Yeah.

[00:02:27] The keys, the keys is actually awesome.

[00:02:30] I love the keys.

[00:02:31] All places in Florida, I mean every time I traveled before I did my half of my honeymoon in Florida

[00:02:37] in Seaside on the Gulf Coast side and that was like 94.

[00:02:42] So there wasn't anything there.

[00:02:44] Yeah.

[00:02:45] No, it definitely changed.

[00:02:46] And I tell everybody we live where you guys vacation.

[00:02:49] Yes.

[00:02:50] Exactly right.

[00:02:51] Well, you live, did you say St. Pete or you said Tampa?

[00:02:54] I live in Hillsborough County, like Tampa area, but the main headquarters is St. Pete.

[00:02:59] So I commute over the Skyway Bridge, the big bridge that everyone is terrified of.

[00:03:04] I drive that bridge every day.

[00:03:06] Oh, I love that.

[00:03:07] Fill me in.

[00:03:08] Why are they terrified?

[00:03:09] So it's not really high and in 1982 or 84 a barge hit it and took the bridge down

[00:03:13] and it killed like 30 people because a Greyhound bus went over.

[00:03:16] It was horrible.

[00:03:17] Right.

[00:03:18] And then I was like, oh, I'm going to go to the beach.

[00:03:21] 30 people because a Greyhound bus went over.

[00:03:23] It was horrible.

[00:03:24] Right.

[00:03:25] But they were the ones that actually came up with what we call dolphins, believe it or

[00:03:31] not.

[00:03:32] That's what they're called.

[00:03:33] But they're concrete barriers now that actually sit out and away from the bridge for the

[00:03:37] new bridge and it actually blocks.

[00:03:39] So if like a cruise ship or something was to lose control, it'll help the first

[00:03:43] and not hit the bridge.

[00:03:44] And that's supposed to be implemented now like in bridges all over that cross

[00:03:50] water.

[00:03:51] Wow.

[00:03:52] That is greatness.

[00:03:53] So I love St. Pete.

[00:03:55] Yes, because I used to go to a conferences there every year and just it's a fantastic

[00:03:59] place.

[00:04:00] But I also love Tampa because I had clients in Tampa for years and I fell in love with

[00:04:07] Burns Steakhouse.

[00:04:08] Burns is an experience if you ever have time to come to Florida, you have to especially

[00:04:14] Tampa, you have to do it.

[00:04:15] It is the second time you've talked about this place.

[00:04:18] You have to take out a mortgage to go there.

[00:04:21] Well, then start filing your paperwork, William, because when you go down there in June,

[00:04:27] we're on current and you're taking me there.

[00:04:29] Is it on the East Coast of Florida?

[00:04:32] Yeah, yeah, Tampa is on.

[00:04:35] Yeah, it's worthy anyhow.

[00:04:38] So the work you do right now for Otter PR, do y'all shorten it to Otter or do you

[00:04:44] say Otter PR?

[00:04:45] Maybe we say Otter because internally, but I mean if you don't really put the PR in

[00:04:49] there, people might not know what you do.

[00:04:52] Animal Sanctuary.

[00:04:53] I clicked on their application by the way.

[00:05:00] Who doesn't like Otters?

[00:05:02] Seriously.

[00:05:03] And they have this logo.

[00:05:05] See?

[00:05:06] All right.

[00:05:07] So what are you into right now with your current position?

[00:05:10] Like what's top of mind for you these days?

[00:05:12] So I am the head of HR.

[00:05:14] I do everything.

[00:05:15] I am the first one you will meet if you're doing an interview with us.

[00:05:18] I do first round interviews on the recruiting side.

[00:05:20] I'm the one that goes through your assessments.

[00:05:23] I'm the one that onboard you.

[00:05:25] I am also the one that you will get in trouble with if you're not doing your

[00:05:28] work and put your performance plan.

[00:05:30] So it can be scary HR, but I really try not to be.

[00:05:35] One thing I really do is I try to tell everybody if you're getting put on

[00:05:38] a performance plan, there's a reason why and we've probably already had a

[00:05:41] verbal discussion on it, right?

[00:05:43] Now we're just keeping track so we can make sure that we're helping support

[00:05:46] you because some people will get on plans and they don't have this

[00:05:50] manager support.

[00:05:52] And we need to make sure we're holding the managers accountable too.

[00:05:55] Right.

[00:05:56] So I, the biggest thing right now is when we're hiring people,

[00:06:00] I have such a flood of applicants come in.

[00:06:04] We put up PR assistant rollout not too long ago and I had over a

[00:06:09] thousand applicants come in way too many.

[00:06:13] And I tightened up my first round like before they even get through

[00:06:17] the assessments because we do pretty good assessments to kind of filter.

[00:06:20] So up to, you know, the percentage they need to have and I still think

[00:06:24] I have, I think 134 people right now just sitting that they've got

[00:06:28] the assessment and gotten the score and need to be reviewed.

[00:06:31] So that's for one position.

[00:06:34] I mean, come on.

[00:06:35] Like, that's insane.

[00:06:37] Cause there's so many good people that come through the pipeline and

[00:06:40] you're like, Oh, I really want this person.

[00:06:42] I would love this person's a great cultural fit.

[00:06:45] And it's what do you, what do you do?

[00:06:47] You know, it's hard.

[00:06:49] Where did you post the job?

[00:06:51] So we, like on deed.

[00:06:53] Yeah, it goes on on deed and career site.

[00:06:56] Yeah.

[00:06:57] Careers are career site and we use Breezy that HR.

[00:07:00] Of course.

[00:07:01] They're out of Florida.

[00:07:02] Makes sense.

[00:07:03] And we, we love that because it's so easy to use.

[00:07:06] I mean, it's just, it helps me keep track of everybody.

[00:07:09] My assessments are in there.

[00:07:11] So I really like it.

[00:07:13] Our CEO loves it.

[00:07:14] So that if he's happy, I'm happy.

[00:07:17] 100%.

[00:07:18] To be the opposite way.

[00:07:20] If you're happy, he's happy.

[00:07:23] Exactly.

[00:07:24] Do you, do you think the, this might be a loaded question.

[00:07:28] Or am I not?

[00:07:29] Do you, do you think the job description has,

[00:07:35] has impacted the number of people that applied to your job.

[00:07:39] And why I'm, why I'm phrasing it that way is this is my bias.

[00:07:44] So speak from that.

[00:07:46] I think a job description should both attract and repel.

[00:07:51] Like somebody should read a job description.

[00:07:53] Oh hell no.

[00:07:54] That's not for me.

[00:07:55] Right.

[00:07:56] And the people that didn't read it and go, oh yeah,

[00:07:58] this is exactly what I've been looking for all my life.

[00:08:00] Yes.

[00:08:01] So I, I look at a thousand candidates as historically us being

[00:08:07] in love with volume.

[00:08:09] But not necessarily putting me in the things in our job description

[00:08:15] or career site, whatever.

[00:08:16] In the things that would repel people.

[00:08:19] You know, like it's fair.

[00:08:21] That's a fair assessment.

[00:08:23] I'm not disagreeing with that.

[00:08:25] Okay.

[00:08:26] So next time you post, will you,

[00:08:30] will you think of that differently?

[00:08:32] I will definitely think of that.

[00:08:33] I do think we definitely attract in the aspect,

[00:08:38] especially on like the publicist side.

[00:08:40] We're not your traditional public relations firm, right?

[00:08:44] We're not these 25, 30 year old established firms that are

[00:08:48] very archaic in their methods and pay for a year up front.

[00:08:52] And if you get something cool,

[00:08:53] if you don't, oh well, you signed a contract and you're in.

[00:08:56] You know, we're very, we've really worked hard to make sure

[00:08:59] that we have relationships established with different people

[00:09:02] to get our clients the exposure that they're needing

[00:09:05] to be able to give guarantees saying, hey,

[00:09:07] you're not, we're not putting you in Forbes right out the gate.

[00:09:10] Right?

[00:09:11] Like we can't necessarily do that.

[00:09:12] Your company just started, but let's build you up

[00:09:15] to where Forbes is asking for you.

[00:09:17] And so that's our goal is to keep, you know,

[00:09:20] the clients where they just keep getting steam and building up.

[00:09:23] And I've been so grateful in the fact with it being a startup is

[00:09:27] not only, I mean, I have 15 plus years HR experience, right?

[00:09:31] So I know HR like I can do it.

[00:09:34] And I know I'm good at it.

[00:09:36] That's one thing.

[00:09:37] I'm not the most confident human on the planet.

[00:09:39] I'll be full disclosure on that when I'm probably my own worst

[00:09:41] enemy, but when it comes to dealing with other people

[00:09:44] and helping them, especially in their job,

[00:09:47] I know I'm good at that and advocating for that.

[00:09:50] But I think with our job things, we're willing to train

[00:09:54] and we're going to take someone that maybe is fresh out of college

[00:09:58] and they went for a communication degree, but have no experience.

[00:10:01] We're going to teach you our way and it's not the traditional way

[00:10:05] and that's okay because that's kind of what we want.

[00:10:08] We want to make sure that we're, you know,

[00:10:10] training you the way that we want you to work with our clients

[00:10:13] because it's working for us.

[00:10:15] Yeah.

[00:10:16] And some of that volume, I was thinking the same thing,

[00:10:19] William is a job description screening out versus in,

[00:10:22] but graduation is here.

[00:10:26] Yes.

[00:10:27] All of these people are graduating and saying,

[00:10:31] my mom and dad are going to charge me rent or they're going

[00:10:34] to kick me out.

[00:10:35] They just spent all this money on degrees.

[00:10:37] They need a job.

[00:10:38] And I think that's the way because for the,

[00:10:41] I missed the memo telling my 18 year old when she first

[00:10:44] turned 18 and I could charge her rent.

[00:10:45] Nobody gave me that memo in my adult book.

[00:10:48] No, there's a comic on Netflix.

[00:10:51] His name is earthquake.

[00:10:52] He's from Atlanta and he has a bit on this.

[00:10:56] He goes when you turn 18,

[00:10:59] I go from becoming or from your father to your advisor.

[00:11:05] Right.

[00:11:06] So when something goes on in your life,

[00:11:08] I can didn't say I will advise you to do this.

[00:11:13] So, so it's like disconnect.

[00:11:16] We're just going to, you know, your money is your money.

[00:11:18] And at 18.

[00:11:19] Good luck with that.

[00:11:21] But I think, you know, like with what Ryan said on the college stuff,

[00:11:25] graduation stuff, I think there's something there,

[00:11:28] there because you also say we don't mind.

[00:11:31] You don't have to have 10 years of experience.

[00:11:33] Okay. We get it.

[00:11:34] You need to be trained.

[00:11:36] If you've already got academic, you can write.

[00:11:38] Okay.

[00:11:39] Great.

[00:11:40] So we're going to train you in our specific and unique way.

[00:11:44] Yeah.

[00:11:45] If I'm, if I'm graduating University of Texas.

[00:11:48] And it got a comms degree in a journalism minor.

[00:11:51] I'm attracted to that because I had no,

[00:11:54] the expectation isn't,

[00:11:56] I have to come in with a network and all this other crazy stuff.

[00:12:01] It's like they continue like raw clay and,

[00:12:04] and build me up.

[00:12:06] Right.

[00:12:07] And that's, that's the beautiful thing of it.

[00:12:09] And we've,

[00:12:10] we've had some individuals that have come in and they are super stars.

[00:12:14] I mean,

[00:12:15] they're amazing with the clients.

[00:12:17] They've got the softwares down packed.

[00:12:20] They can handle more caseloads than some of the other, you know,

[00:12:24] people that maybe were tenured and came from other PR firms.

[00:12:27] Right.

[00:12:28] So there's been success in that.

[00:12:31] Now that's a double-edged sword.

[00:12:33] Right.

[00:12:34] Cause we have brand new people that, you know,

[00:12:37] have been hustling and they get promoted,

[00:12:39] but then they don't have the managerial skills.

[00:12:41] And so that's been something I'm shifting my focus actually this summer

[00:12:46] where we're actually going to do more one-on-one managerial trainings

[00:12:50] where I'm going to sit with the managers and the account strategist

[00:12:53] and really help them because their emotional intelligence needs to be worked on

[00:12:57] and not saying anything negative.

[00:12:59] It's just,

[00:13:00] No, no, no.

[00:13:01] People don't know that with your EQ, you really have to try.

[00:13:06] Yeah.

[00:13:07] And you really have to push and you really have to challenge yourself

[00:13:10] to take yourself out of the situation and look at it as an objective third party.

[00:13:14] And people don't, we're all human.

[00:13:16] We all have emotions.

[00:13:17] We want to have emotional reactions.

[00:13:19] And sometimes it's great.

[00:13:21] Yeah.

[00:13:22] Let's see.

[00:13:23] Past performance and success in performance,

[00:13:27] not necessarily an indicator of a great manager.

[00:13:30] Right?

[00:13:31] Like we, we've, I mean, literally if we ran AI through the last probably

[00:13:36] dozen conversations we've had, I mean, this is it.

[00:13:40] This is the, this is the problem where middle management, right?

[00:13:44] Like first level managers, they're like, they were so good.

[00:13:48] They were the best sales person in the world.

[00:13:50] They really suck as a manager.

[00:13:53] Like their entire sales team is quitting.

[00:13:55] Yeah.

[00:13:56] We didn't give them the tools and resources to be successful.

[00:13:59] It was a battlefield promotion.

[00:14:01] And we didn't give them those.

[00:14:03] And I think when you, when you're talking about EQ, one of the things I love

[00:14:07] about what you're going to do this summer is you're a third party

[00:14:12] actually can say, okay, this is what I hear you saying.

[00:14:15] Okay.

[00:14:16] Is that what you hear them saying?

[00:14:17] Okay.

[00:14:18] No, what I hear, you know, like a third party can mediate that.

[00:14:22] Yes.

[00:14:23] And then there's them just doing it on their own.

[00:14:26] It's left to, hey, I'm busy.

[00:14:28] Okay.

[00:14:29] I know we had an hour.

[00:14:30] Can we get this done in 20 minutes?

[00:14:31] Okay.

[00:14:32] I don't have 20 minutes.

[00:14:33] Can we get it done in 10 and like everybody's busy.

[00:14:35] It doesn't get prioritized.

[00:14:36] And so empathy does isn't, isn't an ingredient that gets baked

[00:14:42] in.

[00:14:43] And so a third party make sure that it ensures that that

[00:14:48] empathy is, it's just a conversation tripping with that.

[00:14:51] Right.

[00:14:52] Yes.

[00:14:53] And you have to have a certain talent to be empathetic to all

[00:14:56] aspects because you have to understand the human side of it,

[00:14:59] people going through things, people having a human reaction or

[00:15:03] response to something that's going on in their personal life

[00:15:06] and they're bringing it to work and they don't even realize

[00:15:08] it.

[00:15:09] And also being empathetic to understanding the CEO and the

[00:15:13] CMO and saying, Hey, they're not getting the job done.

[00:15:16] What's going on?

[00:15:17] And this person has opened up to you and told you but asked

[00:15:21] you to keep confidence.

[00:15:22] So how do you have your loyalty to your company but also know

[00:15:26] that your staff can trust you.

[00:15:28] And so there's a very fine line there on what you can do and I

[00:15:31] think I have mastered that aspect of being able to have

[00:15:35] conversations openly.

[00:15:37] I do think that it helps that the C-sweets are founders

[00:15:41] especially.

[00:15:42] They have a high level of respect for me and I have a

[00:15:45] high level of respect for them.

[00:15:47] I can come in and close the door and tell them, listen, I

[00:15:50] don't have anyone else to vent to because I am your top person

[00:15:54] when it comes to the people.

[00:15:55] So I don't have a vocalizing avenue here.

[00:15:59] You need to listen to me.

[00:16:00] I'm going to complain and I'm going to complain hard for

[00:16:03] a minute.

[00:16:04] And if you want me to do something, then we'll do it.

[00:16:07] But sometimes that's all it is, is I just need to come

[00:16:10] out with it and say, I've had four people come to me

[00:16:13] and they are so upset and I've calmed it down, but now I'm

[00:16:17] upset.

[00:16:18] And I have all that emotion that's built up in me and I

[00:16:20] can't do anything with it because I had to channel my

[00:16:23] own EQ to keep it regulated and someone has to hear it

[00:16:26] and it's too confidential.

[00:16:27] So guess what?

[00:16:29] You're on the list.

[00:16:31] You know what they listen and they were like, okay, what

[00:16:34] do we do?

[00:16:35] And sometimes they can't do anything.

[00:16:37] I'm like, sometimes I just kind of work on it now on

[00:16:39] the back end, but thank you.

[00:16:41] And I'm like, and don't bring this up at my next review.

[00:16:44] No, it's a conversation with no outcomes.

[00:16:46] I love the way people tell me that like, okay, I'm going

[00:16:49] to tell you this in confidence.

[00:16:50] I'm like, okay, I'm not going to tweet it out or whatever.

[00:16:53] And then they say, you can't tell your wife.

[00:16:56] You can't tell anybody.

[00:16:59] I'm like 100%.

[00:17:02] I'm like, after, here's what I know after 30 years of

[00:17:05] marriage, my wife's going to know everything.

[00:17:07] So if this is a deal breaker for you, go ahead and

[00:17:10] stop.

[00:17:11] Cause if you think for a moment that I'm not going to

[00:17:14] tell my wife, yeah, that's just insane.

[00:17:16] I won't use names.

[00:17:17] My husband doesn't know the names of the people in my

[00:17:19] office anyway.

[00:17:20] Like, yeah, he doesn't.

[00:17:21] He's terrible with names.

[00:17:23] It took him three weeks to remember my name and I

[00:17:26] still marry them.

[00:17:27] So I mean, there's that.

[00:17:29] Fair statement.

[00:17:30] Fair statement.

[00:17:31] I think we need to talk to him and get that story.

[00:17:34] No, no, no.

[00:17:35] You would love him.

[00:17:37] I'm going to tell you this is this big burly 235 pound

[00:17:42] all muscular man.

[00:17:43] And he is the biggest teddy bearer with the kindest

[00:17:46] and he just is that him standing behind you?

[00:17:50] Is that somewhere it dude?

[00:17:51] No, that's a different picture.

[00:17:53] Oh, no, the man standing behind you.

[00:17:56] Oh no, there's no men standing.

[00:17:59] You know what it reminds me of my pit bulls.

[00:18:02] My both we have two pits brother and sister.

[00:18:06] They look intimidating.

[00:18:08] But when you look, you look at him, you're like, Holy shit,

[00:18:11] hide your, you know, hide everything because they're

[00:18:13] about to eat your car.

[00:18:15] Yeah.

[00:18:16] These dogs, if you gave them, if you gave them a Dorito chip,

[00:18:19] they would, they would show you where the safe is.

[00:18:22] There's such, there's such teddy bears.

[00:18:24] I'm like, I get it.

[00:18:26] There's still that fear though of like, they're just

[00:18:29] going to snap at you.

[00:18:31] Like right there.

[00:18:33] They're excited.

[00:18:34] They're excited, but, but so okay.

[00:18:38] So we got a good, a really good bit on what you're going to do this summer.

[00:18:41] Yes.

[00:18:42] Tell us what you pull.

[00:18:44] Okay.

[00:18:45] Let's go back to high school or college either or it doesn't matter

[00:18:48] because it's my college and is a little weird.

[00:18:51] Okay.

[00:18:52] Good.

[00:18:53] We like weird.

[00:18:54] Let's do it.

[00:18:55] We like where what did you want to be when you were younger?

[00:18:58] When I was in high school, I honestly had no idea.

[00:19:02] I assumed I was going to be in something with law enforcement.

[00:19:06] Just because I have family that was involved in law enforcement

[00:19:09] always had a respect for law enforcement in general.

[00:19:12] And just, I'm, I'm a rule follower.

[00:19:15] I'm kind of by the book on stuff.

[00:19:17] I mean, I guess that's why HR fits now.

[00:19:19] Yep.

[00:19:20] Yep.

[00:19:21] You know, policies, procedures.

[00:19:23] There's a handbook.

[00:19:24] Yes.

[00:19:25] So when I went into college originally,

[00:19:28] I went to University of South Florida and I was getting my degree

[00:19:32] in criminology with the intention of applying for the U.S.

[00:19:36] Marshals service.

[00:19:37] Oh, tracks.

[00:19:38] They, I think I could totally see you on like CSI.

[00:19:41] Oh yeah.

[00:19:42] In the office room at the, at the computer, like direct.

[00:19:45] Tracks.

[00:19:46] The show.

[00:19:47] Tracks.

[00:19:48] All this tracks.

[00:19:49] No.

[00:19:50] So at that time, you know, remember I graduated high school

[00:19:54] in 01.

[00:19:55] Right.

[00:19:56] So when I was in college, September 11th happened.

[00:20:01] Yeah.

[00:20:02] So a big uptick in like, you know, people wanting to serve their

[00:20:07] country and do things.

[00:20:08] And I was like, I am not made for the military.

[00:20:10] And I know that.

[00:20:11] And that is okay.

[00:20:12] But, you know, being in the criminology department and having

[00:20:15] all that access, you know, it's like U.S.

[00:20:17] Marshals, they want women, they want men.

[00:20:21] They can put us undercover a lot easier.

[00:20:24] Right.

[00:20:25] I was, I was very much the wallflower in school.

[00:20:29] So like I knew everybody, but everyone didn't necessarily know

[00:20:33] me.

[00:20:34] I just kind of blended into the background.

[00:20:36] Right.

[00:20:37] Like I didn't, I wasn't a cheerleader.

[00:20:38] I didn't.

[00:20:39] You know, I wasn't president of, you know,

[00:20:41] those student council or anything like that.

[00:20:43] I was just, I got good grades.

[00:20:44] I did my thing, but I also just kind of came up with

[00:20:47] myself.

[00:20:48] Only child.

[00:20:49] So no big deal.

[00:20:50] So I was really gung-ho on it.

[00:20:52] And then I met my husband.

[00:20:54] His fault.

[00:20:55] The wheels of the bus.

[00:20:56] This is where they fall off.

[00:20:57] Got it.

[00:20:58] It's all Bobby's fault.

[00:20:59] So I met my husband.

[00:21:01] I knew immediately, I was like, all my plans are done.

[00:21:04] I was like, I don't know what I'm going to do with my life now,

[00:21:07] but I was like, I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:09] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:10] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:11] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:12] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:13] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:14] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:15] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:16] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:17] I'm not going to do this.

[00:21:18] I don't know what I'm going to do with my life now,

[00:21:20] but I'm not going away.

[00:21:21] I'm not leaving him.

[00:21:22] He's a, I always say former Marine,

[00:21:24] because he's not actively in,

[00:21:25] but I don't say that.

[00:21:26] I know you don't say they're not former Marines,

[00:21:28] but he was not too long out of this service.

[00:21:31] He's a little bit old.

[00:21:32] But he was out of the core.

[00:21:33] He had been previously engaged in the core.

[00:21:35] And one of the things he had said it was like, listen,

[00:21:38] I want to be with you,

[00:21:40] but you know, he's like, I want to support you if you

[00:21:43] to do this, but the reason I ended my engagement was because she didn't have time for me even

[00:21:47] when I got back from my deployments. It's like I want to start a family. I want to grow with

[00:21:52] somebody and I said, I'll figure something out. So I switched gears drastically by finding out

[00:22:02] on my 21st birthday. I was pregnant with my oldest daughter now. We were we met when I was

[00:22:10] 19. So we had been together for a few years and we were wanting to get married and we were going

[00:22:14] to wait till my 21st birthday to go to Vegas and elope just to irritate my dad. That was the whole

[00:22:19] purpose. I like all this. I like all of this. Let me get some popcorn. Oh my God. I love all this.

[00:22:26] I was feeling a little sick. Didn't understand why I was feeling sick. Of course. When I think,

[00:22:32] when we were first, when we first got out was pregnant. I was like 90 pounds soaked in what I

[00:22:36] was a very small little person. So me being sick, not really a shocker. But my husband's like,

[00:22:43] did you do a pregnancy test? And I'm like, well, no, why? And he's like, you probably should rule

[00:22:46] that out based on you getting sick every single morning. And I'm like,

[00:22:52] still boning sickness for a reason, but you know,

[00:22:55] grossing me out. So I was like, okay, we'll find that. I'll just do it. And I literally

[00:22:59] on my birthday before we went to spaghetti warehouse for dinner. I did a pregnancy test.

[00:23:03] I missed that space. That was a good restaurant. So I was like, oh my gosh. And he was like,

[00:23:09] this is amazing. And I was like, what? I was like, we're not ready for this.

[00:23:15] I ended up going to I ended up going to work for an insurance company. So I would have good

[00:23:20] benefits. You know, worked there. I had my first daughter, I actually had my first

[00:23:25] daughter and I took two years off where my husband worked three jobs. He refused to let

[00:23:28] me work. So me and my oldest daughter were like best little pals and you know, go to the mall

[00:23:34] playing in the playgrounds. And that was probably one of the best experiences of my life. And I'm

[00:23:37] very grateful to the state to my husband for that, to give me that time. Then went into the insurance

[00:23:43] aspect got insured and licensed to write policies in like 15 different states.

[00:23:49] Again, policies.

[00:23:50] Policy.

[00:23:50] Policy.

[00:23:51] You're seeing this, right?

[00:23:52] I got rules.

[00:23:52] There's rules.

[00:23:54] All righty.

[00:23:55] So you're seeing a trend, right?

[00:23:56] I am.

[00:23:57] I am.

[00:23:59] Then my father was in a motorcycle accident and passed away.

[00:24:05] And I,

[00:24:06] Oh my God.

[00:24:07] Yeah. And 80 year old woman just turned right out in front of him on a road. She never, she

[00:24:12] claimed she never saw him. He was very old school. He was a California Highway Patrol

[00:24:17] motorcycle officer back in the day. He wrote he was a Vietnam veteran in the Army.

[00:24:23] And he was one of those old guys that rode his motorcycle without a helmet.

[00:24:28] Oh yeah. Oh yeah.

[00:24:29] And that's what did him in because his body was fine. It was because he hit his head

[00:24:33] and that's why I passed away. So that happened in 08. I shut down. I left my job. I said,

[00:24:42] I can't do this. I didn't, I lost faith. I lost everything. My husband stuck by my side. He's

[00:24:50] like you need to get help. You need therapy. He's like, I love you and you're not even

[00:24:55] you don't want to take care of yourself, let alone your daughter who my daughter was four,

[00:25:00] no three, three going on for the time. He's like, you've got to get help to me.

[00:25:04] And I finally was like, yeah, you're right. I need help. And I did get help. And I went

[00:25:08] to counseling for about six months and started volunteering at my daughter's school because

[00:25:13] she was about to start kindergarten. So I got involved there, which surprisingly was

[00:25:18] the same school that I went to elementary school. So there were still my kindergarten

[00:25:23] teachers still works there to this day. Oh man. And I was volunteering with her and that gave me

[00:25:29] a little bit of like, okay, I have some purpose. Yeah, yeah. Found out. Yes. Meeting came back into

[00:25:35] life. Exactly. Then found out we were pregnant with our second daughter. So I was able to stay

[00:25:40] home for a couple years, have her volunteer and actually found a church nearby. I was the PTA

[00:25:47] president at the time at my daughter's school and went to the church to ask for a blanket drive

[00:25:52] because it was a title one school. So it's in a very poor community and 80% of the population there

[00:25:59] are at or below poverty level. And so there were kids in that school that they would have to take

[00:26:04] turns with the blankets during the winter because there wasn't enough blankets for all the kids.

[00:26:08] So I was just trying to do what I could find some purpose. I met one of the

[00:26:13] children directors there and one of the pastors there and they were like,

[00:26:17] we'd love you to come to church. Now mind you, this church is in a retirement community. So it

[00:26:20] was 55 and up all older retirees like their age with 72. And so they're like, we'd love for you

[00:26:27] girls to come to church. Can I go? We need some young blood. We need some.

[00:26:33] We can take that two ways. Do I look 55 or like what are we doing? They want to get

[00:26:39] in blood but I was like, where are you going to get kids? I was like, my girls are really

[00:26:43] well-behaved but I don't know if they're going to get through an hour long church. So

[00:26:45] it's like, oh no, we have a kids club and I'm like, wait, what? You have a what?

[00:26:49] And they're like, no, we have a kids club. And so I was like, okay, I was like, you know what?

[00:26:52] We'll try it and we went and I started volunteering there and then they asked me to be the youth

[00:26:59] director because they didn't have anybody that was young enough to prove up with teenagers.

[00:27:04] And mind you, I have zero religious experience. I learned it there at church. So I ended up

[00:27:13] doing youth pastoring there part-time. They were building a new building and they didn't have

[00:27:19] anybody to run the administrative side. I started volunteering. Their staff parish group was like,

[00:27:25] hey, do you have a resume? And I go, I haven't worked in like three years guys.

[00:27:32] Don't run a background check. Oh my background is so clean. It's depressing. Like the

[00:27:39] the most boring human on the planet. But I went ahead and gave them a resume and they're like,

[00:27:45] all right, we want you to start working here. And I started off just as like the front desk

[00:27:49] helping, becoming the pastor's assistant and then ended up becoming the director of operations.

[00:27:55] And I was doing all their human resource work, all their vendor work. I was seeing the members

[00:28:00] from the first time they came in as a visitor and putting them in the columbarium when they

[00:28:04] passed away. I was doing all of it. And that was when I really kind of started to understand HR a

[00:28:11] little bit more because the only HR I had understood was when I was putting in my resignation after my

[00:28:15] dad died and having an exit interview and being emotional. Like I had no understanding of HR before

[00:28:21] that. So I actually went back to school and graduated in 2022 with my human resource management

[00:28:30] degree. Oh, very cool. Very nice. And did that while working at the church full time. And then

[00:28:37] I told the church, I don't know if you're going to be able to afford to keep me now because

[00:28:42] with the degree and with the years of experience I've gained, I know my worth and I want to be

[00:28:48] able to grow keep growing and I've hit my ceiling. I was doing everything. I mean, I was doing

[00:28:55] I was filling in on preaching. I'm like, guys, I can't do anymore. And I want to keep, I want to

[00:29:00] keep growing. I'm like, and so you know, I'm doing children's ministry stuff. I'm doing youth

[00:29:04] ministry stuff. I'm volunteering. I'm taking these kids to camp. I'm like, I'm doing all your

[00:29:09] vendor stuff. I'm doing all your IT support. I'm doing all of it. I got nowhere else to go.

[00:29:15] And I was I cried when I told them that I was going to start looking and my my mentor,

[00:29:22] my absolute mentor, his name is Sam Roar. He was a chaplain in the Air Force and then

[00:29:29] was a pastor and retired from that church. He retired right before I ended up leaving

[00:29:34] or right after no, he left right after I left. And he really helped mentor me behind to hone

[00:29:41] in the E2 skills and really have me tap into that emotional intelligence. That man had a gift

[00:29:47] for he would sit there and have a conversation with you. And it could be the worst conversation

[00:29:52] in the on the planet. And he would make you think you initiated the conversation and

[00:29:56] you came to the conclusion he wanted you to on your own. It was a Jedi.

[00:30:02] People like that Jedi. And so I these aren't the droids you're looking for literally. And so

[00:30:09] I really I tapped into that. And I still talk to him to this day. And when I'm really

[00:30:16] stressed out about something, I'm like, I need to bounce something off of you. So he still, you

[00:30:20] know, gives me that insight. And he always tells me he's like, you don't you already know the answer.

[00:30:24] He's like, I know you already know the answer. He's like, but it's fine. I'll talk to you.

[00:30:28] And he's just been he was really pivotal, encouraging me to apply at other places. And

[00:30:35] I actually didn't apply at a lot. I think maybe two places. And then Otter's application

[00:30:41] came up and they were actually just looking for an executive admin. But I was so intrigued by

[00:30:46] the logo of the company and I clicked in and I went down this rabbit hole on their website.

[00:30:53] I applied anyway. And when I had the first round interview with one of their recruiting people,

[00:31:01] I was like, Listen, I was like, the role that you're looking for is not the right role that

[00:31:05] you have up there. I'll help you rewrite your job description if you want because I think

[00:31:08] you guys have a great thing going. And he goes, Can I follow up with you? And I said yes.

[00:31:13] And apparently he called the CEO and he goes, if you don't hire her for HR director, we're all

[00:31:17] quitting because we need to make they didn't have an HR person. The CEO acting as the HR person.

[00:31:23] And they knew they were growing and getting that point where they're like, we've got to have somebody

[00:31:27] in. And so I had gone and interviewed with Scott, the CEO. And then he asked me if I could come

[00:31:34] in and meet with him and Jay. And I said yes, because I have questions for you as well.

[00:31:38] They were very scared because I had this 12 years with this church and I guess they thought

[00:31:45] I was going to come in like some sister Francis. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I'm like my husband's a Marine.

[00:31:51] My dad was a truck driver. My grandpa was a sailor. You're good. We're good. You're good.

[00:31:58] I can separate the two. We're good. We're good. So when you did your degree,

[00:32:05] what through that process? So many questions about that. But basically, what did you learn?

[00:32:11] What was shocking? You know, what did you bet? You know, at the end of the day,

[00:32:16] degrees cool, probably certifications cool. Was there anything in that process where you're like,

[00:32:22] oh, hell, I didn't know that. Yeah. Or the a lot of the you're kind of shocked when

[00:32:29] you're thrown into HR. Like this isn't something obviously I was looking for, right? It just

[00:32:33] kind of didn't because I'm good at it. I was shocked and still am honestly to this day

[00:32:39] of how much HR is like the big bully and is don't trust HR. HR is not going to have

[00:32:45] HR is only there for the company. And I'm like, who did this? Yeah. Yeah. I want to blame somebody

[00:32:52] who where doesn't know how I work. Like I don't understand. And I'm like, I don't get it. But

[00:32:58] when I reflect back and I think about working with, I worked at a giant insurance company.

[00:33:03] I mean, they're big. And when I worked there, I was like, yeah, the HR was the scary ones.

[00:33:09] And that one back office that no one wanted to even walk by and get like, use it not doing

[00:33:14] anything. And HR was always the you go there when you have a problem, you go there when

[00:33:20] you need to bring your box with you. You're packing up getting your pink slip. It's never

[00:33:26] been a resource until recently and so recently, probably the last decade, right? Like it's actually

[00:33:32] become a resource for people, especially post COVID pandemic. Like with all of these,

[00:33:41] call them fears that employees had, right? I don't feel right. I'm going to explode

[00:33:47] all this. Now the resources are there. And there's a shit ton of software

[00:33:53] to help manage all of that from mental health to weight loss, everything.

[00:33:58] Yeah. That HR, yeah, has their hand in now. So it's becoming very different.

[00:34:02] Has been that's what honestly pushed me to go ahead and go back to school to get an HR degree

[00:34:07] was because I was seeing that shift of the one for a supportive HR. And I was like, I can do this.

[00:34:13] I'm already doing the paperwork aspect. I'm already the legality aspect. I have the natural

[00:34:19] empathy. I have the natural talent. I mean, if you can survive at a church of retirees for 12 years

[00:34:25] without making it, you can do anything. Let me tell you.

[00:34:32] That was Fallujah for you. You made it past that. You sold out it.

[00:34:38] You know what y'all were talking about a second ago? HR's been branded historically as the no

[00:34:44] department. Yes. And worse than that, there's no good news that emulates from HR. Yes. And so I think

[00:34:52] I think COVID blessing in the disguise, everyone had to depend on and it was it was building of

[00:34:59] that rebuilding trust. Yes. And there can be over communicative and understand kind of what's

[00:35:05] going on to Ryan's point. What do you think is next with HR? Like where do you, if not,

[00:35:13] you know, yourself, where do you think HR goes from here and kind of that next, I would say,

[00:35:20] iteration or evolution? But where do you think they go as professionals?

[00:35:26] I think it has to get to the aspect of once you, I don't think you master empathy. I think empathy

[00:35:32] is something you continually learn and you evolve with based on your age. I'm not the

[00:35:37] same person I am now at almost 42 that I was at 26, right? Like not even remotely close.

[00:35:43] So I think that having more people enter an HR field after they've done other things

[00:35:53] is going to be the biggest bonus for companies. Because if you get someone that was working retail

[00:36:02] in the trenches and then decided, I want to do something where I'm not working these crazy

[00:36:07] hours, I want to have some structure and I want to be able to help people and you have a

[00:36:11] desire and actually find out that you're good at HR and you get into that field,

[00:36:17] they need companies need to make sure that they're taking that into account when they're looking

[00:36:21] to put HR professionals in, not just looking for the person that has all the certifications and

[00:36:25] all the letters at the end of their name. Yeah, you know, HR has become, William to your point,

[00:36:32] I think HR has become over the last, I mean for a long time, but it recently has become part

[00:36:39] of the business like it's a driver for the business, it's no longer personnel department,

[00:36:45] right? So all of these things that we're talking about, they drive revenue, they really do mental

[00:36:52] health productivity, you know, engaging all of this stuff where human resources are people

[00:36:59] within that huge chunk of HR. Is it driver to the business without it, it just doesn't

[00:37:07] function, it's changed. So I'm curious though, Tiffany, to get your take on this, so

[00:37:14] where does HR differ? So when you came in the Otter, how many people were at the company at the

[00:37:20] time? I think maybe 15, 20. Okay, and you're at 60 now, 60 plus, right? Wow. In terms of your

[00:37:33] time span, we've exploded. Right, so what has changed from a 15 person come? Because

[00:37:39] William and I, we've both been part of the 15 person company and larger, but from an HR perspective,

[00:37:46] 15 people they decided, okay, time to take this from the CEO. Let's give it to a real HR person

[00:37:53] to now. New employment laws apply. So there's that, Tiffany, what do you think?

[00:38:03] Yeah, well what's changed? So it was very just the HR was just the documentation, signing an offer

[00:38:10] law, getting a contract. There was no emotional. So me coming in, we joke because we don't do the

[00:38:19] whole family because I have family, I can't stand. I don't do that. I'm like if you have a run,

[00:38:25] if someone says we're family, run. That's take ever. You can choose your friends,

[00:38:30] not your family. Tiffany, the next time you do a job description, that needs to be the first thing.

[00:38:37] Like out of the gate, yes, senior public relations associate, okay. And by the way, boom,

[00:38:43] if someone says that your business, employees, etc., they say family, run. We're not a family.

[00:38:53] We work together. Again, now I'm reading that as a candidate going, okay, that's for me.

[00:39:00] Heather, we might drink at a happy hour outside of that. I don't give up flying. What you do?

[00:39:05] Yeah, I love it. I will joke and tell them I can be like a mama otter in the sense of

[00:39:12] I'm going to try to help you as much as I can, not just in business. Right. You know,

[00:39:18] making sure you're stuff done, but you like we had a new hire there. She's moved down here

[00:39:23] before her husband. They're closing on a house together, but the husband is still

[00:39:28] stationed up north and he doesn't even know if he's going to be at the closing.

[00:39:31] And I told her, I was like, well have you had your title agency make sure that you have

[00:39:35] power of attorney to sign on his behalf? She goes, I don't even know what that is.

[00:39:39] And I was like, you need to put this in a message to your title agency right now.

[00:39:42] And this was day one of her working here. And she was like, you probably just saved me

[00:39:47] a potential like, you know, month backlash of having to go back and forth because we

[00:39:52] wouldn't have had the right paperwork. Thank you so much. And I'm like, that's okay.

[00:39:56] I'm like, I've lived a little bit more life than some of you and I've gone through

[00:39:59] some other things that you guys haven't. And I want to help. So me stepping into

[00:40:04] Otter and taking over the HR side, I was able to put the human into the human resources to

[00:40:11] where now I'm the resource for the humans. And at least at Otter, that's exactly what my job

[00:40:19] is. I am, yes, I make sure the company is compliant. I do re verifies. I make sure that

[00:40:26] you know, we're hitting, you know, FMLA or ADA or all those compliance. I'm up to date on it.

[00:40:33] I'm always following the Department of Labor on new rules that are rolling out.

[00:40:37] You know, obviously policies and procedures, it's my jam. I have no problem doing it.

[00:40:43] But I take time to visit with staff in office. I check in with the ones that, you know, are remote.

[00:40:51] I have conversations with them that are not work related on purpose to just kind of gauge how

[00:40:56] their mental health is doing. When I send, I send a newsletter every month, right? And I do it.

[00:41:03] And it's highlighting everybody that's got a promotion, whether it's, you know, a tier

[00:41:07] promotion or if they've had a lateral move within the company, but just recognizing their

[00:41:11] achievements. We always have our Otter of the month, somebody that's done something, you know,

[00:41:16] pivotal that's been real helpful, supportive of the team, which is kind of stood out. And then

[00:41:21] I may have an announcement like we decided to change something in our performance review.

[00:41:26] So I gave a little short announcement there, but the rest of the newsletter,

[00:41:30] it's only two pages, but the rest of the newsletter, I gave them cheesy fun facts

[00:41:34] of April, like, you know, with the burst stone and how April became. And then I gave

[00:41:38] them a spring into May with a clear mind and things for them to self reflect on and ask questions

[00:41:45] to themselves. How have you given back to someone else in the month of April? What made you smile

[00:41:51] in April, things to make them stop and disconnect their brain from all the work and take a minute

[00:41:57] to think about themselves because if they are not taking care of themselves, they're not

[00:42:01] going to take care of the clients. They're not going to be devoted to the company.

[00:42:04] And then we're going to have a complete turnover and that we were making an investment in them.

[00:42:09] So we want to make sure that we're fully vested. This isn't just about the 40 hours that you show up.

[00:42:16] You know, one of our higher tier place publicist account strategist, he's got a family emergency

[00:42:23] right now. And he was so scared to like say, Hey, I think I need time off. And we told him,

[00:42:30] no, you're taking time. I went in and took him out of the calendar and his manager took all of his

[00:42:36] calls and we were like, we love you. We'll see you in a week. If you need more, that's fine.

[00:42:42] But we've got this. We'll revisit on Friday. Do not call us. Do not sign in your emails.

[00:42:47] Do not worry about anything. Go see your family. And he called me today and he was a little

[00:42:53] emotional and he's like, I just want to tell you thank you. And I was like,

[00:42:56] I've got this. I'm like, if you need to talk to me, I don't care if it's three o'clock in the morning.

[00:43:01] If I don't answer it's because I'm sleeping and I'm like, you know, atomic bomb can go off. I won't

[00:43:05] hear it. But if I'm awake enough to hear my phone ring, I will answer for you. And if we

[00:43:09] need to just if you need to just hear someone's voice, it's fine. You gotta they're human beings.

[00:43:16] Yeah, paying them for a service, but they're still human beings. I got so sick with COVID you

[00:43:23] guys. So sick in 21 right after I first like my first year of being here. Like, or it knows actually

[00:43:32] right before I started is when I was still finishing up the church and I got so sick.

[00:43:36] Then I got sick again the first year I got two times in a row. I have auto immune disease now

[00:43:41] I have heart issues. I have all this stuff. Oh my God. Oh, it's horrible. That's a whole

[00:43:46] another segment for you guys if you want. But I mean, probably I've been to 45 different doctors

[00:43:54] they can't justify anything except long haulers COVID and I have tachycardia and fibromyalgia and just

[00:44:01] list it list it. I don't I still go to work. I still come in but when I'm having a really

[00:44:07] bad day or if I'm having a flare up or something's going on, I message my co founders and I say,

[00:44:13] I cannot drive today. And they're like, they're and they literally say feel better.

[00:44:18] They know I will handle what needs to be handled. It's that respect thing. They know I'm a human.

[00:44:23] I will have bad days. And that's okay. And HR needs to go. They got to start understanding

[00:44:30] these people are human beings. So much of this is going to go into a job description to

[00:44:35] repel people or attract people. We'll give you the transcript and let you run it through.

[00:44:42] Job description. Is there anything professionally? This is the last question for me. Is there anything

[00:44:49] professionally that like achievements that you'd like to achieve? Like next because it's

[00:44:54] you seem goal oriented, you seem like that person like you're gonna think about the next thing.

[00:44:58] I'm gonna do an MBA or get a go do six sigma whatever the bit is. You're gonna find some

[00:45:04] other mountain to climb. Yeah, I want my master's in HR. I really do just because I want to see

[00:45:09] based on how things have changed just over the last few years of me being in school.

[00:45:13] Right. What new things are out there? What new aspects are out there? What new things I could

[00:45:17] potentially learn that could make me better for the company and for the staff because I really

[00:45:23] advocate on the continuing education side of just being a better human in general. You're

[00:45:28] challenging your mind, you're keeping your brain going which keeps your body going. And

[00:45:31] I know I need that right now. Nice. Tiffany, this has been fantastic. Yeah, 100%. We had a really

[00:45:42] good conversation here. Appreciate it. I think everyone who's listening is gonna find some little

[00:45:47] nuggets in here. Oh yeah. And we'll get a lot of comments on the job description so we'll

[00:45:51] pass those over but I love it. Please do. I always love feedback. I'm all for feedback.

[00:45:57] Yeah and for anybody who hasn't heard back from Tiffany yet when you hear this you'll

[00:46:01] understand why and then you won't hate her. It'll be all good. It'll be all good.

[00:46:08] It's so funny that you said that because I tell people when I'm doing first-round interviews

[00:46:11] I'm like, listen, I do not try to ghost people. Please send me an email in two weeks if you

[00:46:16] have a heart for me so I can give you an update. And I do. I take time every single week. I take

[00:46:21] time to go through emails to make sure that I respond to anybody that's asked for an update

[00:46:24] even if it's not a happy update. You know we've done the position. I will still

[00:46:29] try to give them that update. That's the least you can do on a respect level to let them know.

[00:46:35] Go ahead. No it gets back to being humane. Yeah. Yeah. It might be time to get you a recruiter

[00:46:41] in house recruiter. We'll work on that for you. So when we have big hiring pushes yes it would

[00:46:50] be nice to have the help but I personally feel like and this is me being a little

[00:46:57] I'm putting myself over which I don't actually like doing but the ones that I've done first-round

[00:47:02] interviews and the ones that I've said are my 10s and we need to hire and we've hired have been amazing

[00:47:07] and others have done it. I don't know what else they sucked.

[00:47:12] I'm not saying. I'm not saying I'm a great recruiter. Is it correlation or causation? I can't

[00:47:19] remember. As it goes smoothly as I would like let's say.

[00:47:27] Thank you so much for your time today being on the show and sharing your experience and your journey

[00:47:31] with the audience. You've been lovely just thank you. Say hello to your husband for us. I will.

[00:47:36] I'll make sure when this all goes and you guys send me a link up and like

[00:47:39] babe you gotta listen. I gave you lemons on the way home. Exactly. Shout out. Yeah.

[00:47:44] Anyhow thank you again and thanks for the audience. Brian appreciate you.