Empowering Women with Jaidin McCann - HigherHer Ep 14

[00:00:00] Welcome to the HigherHer Podcast by Talent Collective, presenting conversations with inspiring women in talent. And get ready ladies, because this is the last time you're going to hear a man's voice on this show.

[00:00:12] And we're live.

[00:00:14] Welcome everyone to our latest segment of Talent Collective podcast called HigherHer, where Krista, my co-founder and I, we carry on conversations with inspiring women in talent.

[00:00:29] Many of which we have met and had the great pleasure of spending time with as part of our community.

[00:00:36] So we wanted to bring their voices to you and help elevate their stories.

[00:00:40] So today we have a very, very special guest who I'll introduce in a second.

[00:00:44] But first, I'm here with Krista, the lovely Krista Tan, my co-founder. Say hello, hello.

[00:00:49] Hello, hello.

[00:00:53] And we are spending time today with Jaidin.

[00:00:57] She was one of our earliest members, I remember.

[00:01:03] And she was just so gung ho to be a part of the community and really believed in what we were doing.

[00:01:10] Enough about us, more about her.

[00:01:13] She has been with us for a very, very long time and we've been able to see her really shine and elevate, which congratulations on your recent feature.

[00:01:22] I want to hear all about that.

[00:01:25] But nonetheless, Jaidin runs her own firm.

[00:01:29] It is called Jasper Consultancy.

[00:01:31] It's executive search and human capital strategy.

[00:01:35] Also, do you fold in there fractional now?

[00:01:39] Yes.

[00:01:40] Okay, so I'm gonna let you tell all the things.

[00:01:41] But she is CEO and founder and we'll turn it over to you.

[00:01:46] Tell us more, Jaidin.

[00:01:46] Tell us what you're up to and a little bit about your recruiting journey.

[00:01:50] Well, hi guys.

[00:01:52] Nice to be here.

[00:01:52] Thank you so much for having me.

[00:01:54] Yes, I do own an executive search and human capital consulting firm called Jasper Consultancy.

[00:02:00] And really what we set out to do is honestly improve the way the world is led by putting the right leaders in the right places, transforming workplace cultures for better working environments for everyone.

[00:02:11] And really changing the status quo around corporate America.

[00:02:15] Right now there's a huge movement toward, you know, corporate escapees and, you know, reinventing leadership and just so many things to really try and come in and fix the brokenness that has occurred in recent history.

[00:02:31] And so definitely on a mission to really make the lives better for everybody inside of corporate America.

[00:02:37] You definitely are on a mission and you got featured.

[00:02:41] Don't be shy.

[00:02:42] Don't be humble.

[00:02:43] Can you tell us a little bit about this recent feature?

[00:02:48] Yes.

[00:02:49] I guess.

[00:02:50] How would you last night?

[00:02:53] I probably a feature.

[00:02:55] I was honored to be featured on the cover of a magazine as one of the top five influential business leaders of 2024.

[00:03:04] So huge honor.

[00:03:06] Yes.

[00:03:06] Very, very cool.

[00:03:07] And is that unique to Seattle or an industry publication or?

[00:03:13] It is the enterprise world.

[00:03:15] So it is global.

[00:03:16] Oh, my God.

[00:03:17] That's amazing.

[00:03:19] I don't read.

[00:03:20] Yes.

[00:03:21] I don't read.

[00:03:22] I don't do podcasts, so I'm not familiar with any of these things.

[00:03:25] Pardon my naivety.

[00:03:27] But congratulations.

[00:03:28] That is a big feat and you definitely are very influential.

[00:03:32] Obviously in our community and also to other members.

[00:03:34] I know you've shared a lot of like feedback and insights to them.

[00:03:37] So thank you.

[00:03:40] Okay.

[00:03:41] So I want to dive in straight to the tough stuff.

[00:03:44] What we have found really impactful as part of this podcast is when our guests like really share something vulnerable about your recruiting journey, any major challenges or stuff that you've overcame personally.

[00:04:01] Do you have any vulnerable story that you think our audience might resonate with?

[00:04:06] Oh, my gosh, Natalie.

[00:04:08] My whole life is a vulnerable story.

[00:04:12] Oh, gosh.

[00:04:15] I definitely work.

[00:04:19] Work related vulnerable stories.

[00:04:21] I really think becoming a founder for my own company is really has been such a challenge, right?

[00:04:28] There's so many things that people are really great at and they start companies around that.

[00:04:31] For me, it would be talent acquisition, right?

[00:04:33] Human capital strategy, all things HR and people.

[00:04:37] But I'm not, you know, a business development executive or marketing executive or an accountant or a financial executive or any of the other things that make up a successful company.

[00:04:47] And so one thing that I really struggled with at first was, you know, you don't have the capital to hire the people that are better in those areas than you.

[00:04:54] So you're forced to really dive in, learn, adapt, use ChatGPT and be everything to everybody.

[00:05:02] And so I would say that that's definitely a struggle that I faced and had to overcome.

[00:05:07] And I'm still overcoming every day because you can never, you know, you're never going to be as good as at all of those things as you are in your one niche area of expertise.

[00:05:17] So true.

[00:05:19] Mm-hmm.

[00:05:20] Well, thank you for sharing, Jaden.

[00:05:22] And I just find you to be such a breath of fresh air every time I'm with you.

[00:05:27] I just love you so much.

[00:05:30] I love your energy.

[00:05:31] I love your vibe and how positive you are.

[00:05:33] Mm-hmm.

[00:05:34] It's very clear to me how successful you are just because of who you are.

[00:05:38] And I think you bring just that, like...

[00:05:42] She's demure.

[00:05:43] Everybody's saying this word.

[00:05:45] Demure.

[00:05:46] Well, I think you're just very authentic and real and, but also just, yeah, energetic and positive and all the good things.

[00:05:54] So, um, anywho, that is a total side note.

[00:05:57] I have a question for you.

[00:05:59] I promise I'll get to it.

[00:06:01] The best of side notes.

[00:06:02] You could just keep going.

[00:06:04] Go for me now.

[00:06:04] All the time you love today.

[00:06:06] I'm like, stop, stop, stop.

[00:06:08] Okay.

[00:06:08] Let's talk a little bit more about recruiting.

[00:06:10] Um, and you know, just a little bit more about the market and, you know, clearly your company, um, does talent acquisition and recruiting.

[00:06:22] But then also you have that human capital component to it.

[00:06:25] Um, so I'm sure there's a lot of consulting with your clients about retaining those employees and, you know, how performance management and how to retain them and all of that good stuff.

[00:06:34] So, um, tell us maybe like some best practices or tips or tricks that you found, um, either yourself and within your own company or, you know, the ways that you advise your clients on, on how to really attract and retain the best of the best.

[00:06:54] Oh my gosh.

[00:06:55] Oh my gosh.

[00:06:55] Absolutely.

[00:06:56] I could go down this rabbit hole forever.

[00:06:58] Although then people might need to pay for this podcast, but, um, no, I absolutely really big on retention, right?

[00:07:08] I think increasing engagement increases retention and increases productivity and performance and overall organizational success.

[00:07:13] And so one thing that I do when I go in and hire is we offer to consult for free one on building, you know, if you don't have, uh, for startups, for example, if you don't have an interview project, you know, you're going to be a good one.

[00:07:25] That's set up for success.

[00:07:26] Or you don't know how to measure different things, uh, in different stages of the interview process or really build a hiring process for trust.

[00:07:33] Uh, I think one thing is especially in the startup community founders, they hire people to get themselves out of the business.

[00:07:39] That's the goal, but then they don't actually get themselves out of the business because they're too afraid to let go and actually transition that over to that person that they hired.

[00:07:47] And so, um, I think one aspect we do consulting for free for those things, but the other side of the house is I don't want a transactional relationship where we go in and we, we fill a role and you pay us money and we walk away.

[00:08:02] And maybe you come back to us in the future and maybe you don't, right?

[00:08:04] I think that's how most companies tend to work.

[00:08:07] They might say they don't, but it's how they tend to work.

[00:08:10] And for us, one of the big reasons why we offer human capital consulting is let's focus on the retention of this employee, right?

[00:08:16] Do you have a reward system set up to help retain them?

[00:08:19] What does their, um, what does the job description look like?

[00:08:23] Right.

[00:08:23] I really abide by this 80, 20 rule and there's a million 80, 20 rules.

[00:08:27] So I'll define, um, but 80%.

[00:08:30] Yes, absolutely.

[00:08:31] You can come in and do this job.

[00:08:33] You know it well, and 20% room for growth.

[00:08:36] It's a challenge.

[00:08:36] They have to learn and figure it out.

[00:08:38] And right now, uh, going back to that issue with trust, people are really hiring.

[00:08:43] You know, I need someone who've done, who has done this for the last 10, 15, 20 plus years.

[00:08:47] Exactly.

[00:08:47] This, this industry, competitive companies, um, they're not confident maybe in their abilities

[00:08:52] themselves to be able to train and develop that person.

[00:08:54] And they want that subject matter expertise to build that trust.

[00:08:58] But what I really see, and I think a big piece of advice I give, cause I see this more broadly

[00:09:03] is if you really want to engage and retain that professional longterm, which would be the hope, uh, you need to be able to give people a chance, right?

[00:09:12] And to say, yes, we need you to be able to do these things right off the bat.

[00:09:17] But we also want you to be able to learn and grow and develop top performers are continuous learners.

[00:09:22] And you know, one of the number one reasons I hear people looking for new roles, right?

[00:09:26] Is I'm, I'm out of room to grow, whether that's title wise, whether that's, I've been in this position for five years and I'm not going to be promoted.

[00:09:34] So I need to grow myself personally and professionally.

[00:09:37] Um, so that's one thing I would really, really say is making sure in the interview process, you're setting yourself up for success.

[00:09:43] And it's not just who do you need to hire right now, but how do we set ourselves up for success five years from now so that we can keep and retain them?

[00:09:51] Do we have a growth plan in place?

[00:09:52] Um, and just all of the things that go with it.

[00:09:55] Mm hmm. Yeah, such great advice.

[00:09:57] And I love that you're, um, really advising your clients in that way, because I think as recruiters, we just, we see that all the time.

[00:10:07] Like they want exactly the, all the boxes checked and it has to be like, this person's done all of these things before, but like nobody wants to go into a new role and do all the things they've done before.

[00:10:20] Right. Like we, like we do want growth. Right. Most people do. Um, and like you said, those top performers who are, who you want in your organization are going to want more. Um, so how do you give that to them and give them that chance knowing that they have the, um, the aptitude to grow into the role?

[00:10:40] Mm hmm. Absolutely.

[00:10:43] Okay. So this is a funny one.

[00:10:45] Have you ever had a recruitment fail or something that like went awry and turned into a funny story? Something you can share?

[00:10:56] Oh, so many, so many. And I don't know if that's like, uh, just, oh gosh, when you work with people, I like to say it's my, it's my favorite part about my job and my least favorite part about my job. Right.

[00:11:08] So people, they're unpredictable. You're not selling a product to you're selling being and their life experiences and in their free will. So I had, I have a few, but I would say one of the most unexpected ones was I was recruiting.

[00:11:25] From blue origin. And it was an engineering manager back in the day and, you know, senior level, their managerial level, very talented over mechanical engineers. Um, this is my fault. I did not think to go over interview dress code with this person. I just assumed, which you should never do. You know what they say, uh, that they would know how to dress for an in-person interview for an aerospace company.

[00:11:48] But, um, this woman one time showed up in her bikini to her final interview. Uh, it, oh, absolutely. She apparently had just come from the beach. It was there, uh, in Florida and she showed up in her bikini and I did not see that coming. I was in a recruiting agency. So I wasn't, you know, there, but I got a call from my director. Like, why is your candidate showing up in a bikini to her final interview? And I was like, Oh, I'm sorry. What did you just say?

[00:12:14] And I, I did not do my due diligence. Apparently I needed to do so lesson to all recruiters, never skip steps, never assume they know, uh, that I learned that lesson the hard way.

[00:12:25] But even if you would have done your due diligence and prepped, like that's just common sense. Yeah. Come on.

[00:12:32] Like off their rocker. So basically you didn't prep them, but even if you would have, I mean, it's common sense. Like who goes anywhere in their bikini other than like to the swimming pool or to the beach. But you know what, you know what frustrates me?

[00:12:49] Like to think. Yeah. But you know, of course those companies, they call the agency, like, how dare you? Like as if it's you, we always get blamed as an agency.

[00:13:00] But if that would have happened to their corporate recruiter would have been like, well, it happens. Right.

[00:13:06] Yeah. This Canada is crazy.

[00:13:08] Yeah.

[00:13:09] So, well, that, gosh, yeah.

[00:13:13] Not only that.

[00:13:13] I like to take.

[00:13:16] Go ahead.

[00:13:20] Jaden, you go.

[00:13:21] I was going to say, I like to take accountability for what I could have done better, but at the same time, it was her final interview.

[00:13:30] So it's not like it was the very first one and it was me at fault.

[00:13:34] She made it past multiple managers.

[00:13:36] So at that point, but yeah, definitely a funny story.

[00:13:41] Well, and going back to like the recruiting company getting blamed, like the stakes are high, right?

[00:13:48] Like, I mean, you might have like a 30, $50,000 fee on the line.

[00:13:53] Like, of course you don't want that candidate to show up in their bathing suit.

[00:13:57] Like, you know what I mean?

[00:13:58] That's where I think the, like, it's just so, what's it called?

[00:14:04] Like, just doesn't make, it doesn't compute that, like, why a company would blame it on the agency.

[00:14:08] Like, there's zero incentive to send a candidate in their bathing suit on an interview.

[00:14:14] Right.

[00:14:15] Unless they're.

[00:14:16] Oh my gosh.

[00:14:17] Absolutely.

[00:14:21] Oh my goodness.

[00:14:22] Okay.

[00:14:22] Well, we have one final question for you, Jaden.

[00:14:26] Um, so to pivot a little bit out of recruiting, um, and just to talk more high level about women

[00:14:35] in leadership and clearly you've been an amazing leader, uh, throughout your recruiting journey

[00:14:41] and are an amazing leader today.

[00:14:44] Um, so talk to us about what you think, and you obviously recruit a lot of amazing women

[00:14:49] leaders in your executive search firm.

[00:14:51] So what qualities do you think are essential for women in leadership roles?

[00:14:55] And how can women cultivate those qualities?

[00:15:00] That's such an amazing question.

[00:15:02] I love that.

[00:15:04] Um, my go-to is always assertiveness.

[00:15:06] I think it's something that we should, we should absolutely recognize that both genders are equal,

[00:15:12] but not the same.

[00:15:14] And we have strengths as women that men don't naturally have.

[00:15:18] And men have strengths as men that women don't naturally have.

[00:15:20] And I think being confident in what those strengths are and using those to your advantage.

[00:15:25] But one thing I see heavily is that it's a necessity to be more assertive in business.

[00:15:32] And it's a quality that women tend to possess less of.

[00:15:36] And so that's why I always jump to that one first.

[00:15:38] And I've held trainings on this for women.

[00:15:41] But I really do think there is a way to brag about yourself humbly.

[00:15:46] There's tactful honesty.

[00:15:48] There's being your own cheerleader and showing up and advocating for the things that you've

[00:15:52] accomplished and done.

[00:15:54] There's the willingness to negotiate.

[00:15:56] There was a huge study done, actually.

[00:15:58] Oh, gosh.

[00:15:59] I wish I remember who did this.

[00:16:00] I'll research it and send it.

[00:16:02] But there's a huge study done on a gender pay gap.

[00:16:05] And not to say that this is the reason for the gender pay gap.

[00:16:09] I'd like that very, very explicitly clear.

[00:16:11] But what happened in the study was that there was a 20% difference between women who either

[00:16:18] took the offer or negotiated for less, but took the offer that was on the table versus

[00:16:23] men that negotiated way higher.

[00:16:25] And then similarly, men with promotions, they asked for them.

[00:16:29] And women didn't tend to ask for them and have those conversations in the same way.

[00:16:34] And I think that's really illuminating to see that there's a 20% pay gap based on just

[00:16:41] asking, negotiating, being willing to have those conversations.

[00:16:45] Having the confidence maybe is what holds people back, having the knowledge.

[00:16:48] So anything that we can do as women and as men and advocates to really help women be more

[00:16:55] assertive, be more confident, have the tools under their tool belts to have those

[00:16:59] conversations.

[00:17:00] I think not just in terms of pay equality, but also in terms of being in the room, right?

[00:17:06] Having your voice heard, moving up in companies.

[00:17:09] And I think that assertiveness is one area that across the board, I see more women wanting

[00:17:13] and needing to grow in.

[00:17:15] So that's the first one that comes to my mind that I'm a big advocate for.

[00:17:19] Oh my goodness.

[00:17:20] You are just speaking my language.

[00:17:23] I feel like it's so silly, especially within the recruiting and HR space.

[00:17:31] When I see women, like at my old company, I hired both a recruiter and an HR person and

[00:17:37] neither of them negotiated.

[00:17:40] They didn't even ask.

[00:17:41] They did not even ask.

[00:17:43] And I was sitting here thinking, of course you're not going to get any more money because

[00:17:46] you didn't even ask, right?

[00:17:48] Like, I mean, maybe we would have said no, but maybe we wouldn't have.

[00:17:51] And the person that asked is going to guarantee at least there's like a consideration, right?

[00:17:57] But like, and to have like a recruiter not negotiate, like that's like, come on.

[00:18:04] Like you see this happening with all of your candidates.

[00:18:08] Like this plays out, you know, across every single role that you're recruiting for.

[00:18:15] And so, yeah, couldn't agree more on that one.

[00:18:18] And I know it's scary to ask, but like, just make the ask, you know, even if your voice

[00:18:23] is quivering or you're scared to hit send on the email, whatever, just do it, right?

[00:18:30] Yeah.

[00:18:31] It doesn't hurt to ask.

[00:18:33] The worst that's going to happen is they say no when you're right back where you were

[00:18:35] before, I've never seen a company nor have I ever pulled an offer because someone asked

[00:18:41] for more money than we can give, right?

[00:18:42] You still, we still want you to work for us.

[00:18:45] We still want you to work for our clients.

[00:18:47] Our clients don't want you to work for them.

[00:18:49] You should always ask the worst that happens is we say no.

[00:18:52] The best that happens is you make way more money.

[00:18:53] So, and that, and not even with salaries, but sign-ons, right?

[00:18:57] That's one thing I think people should always ask is just, Hey, is there a sign-on?

[00:19:01] Because it could have not been given to you at all, but even just asking, they're

[00:19:05] like, Oh yeah, we actually can give you X amount.

[00:19:08] And it depends on the company, but typically they're pre-approved for a certain range of

[00:19:13] a sign-on bonus.

[00:19:14] And so if you don't ask, why would they give it to you?

[00:19:17] They want to save the company money.

[00:19:18] But if you do ask if they're pre-approved, why?

[00:19:21] I mean, that could be potentially, if you're in a fortune 500 that I've worked for before,

[00:19:25] that can be 20 to 50, 60, 80.

[00:19:29] I've seen it go up to 80 K in a sign-on that you just did not support.

[00:19:32] Wow.

[00:19:33] Oh my goodness.

[00:19:34] Yeah.

[00:19:36] I can caveat, fortune 500.

[00:19:39] Definitely.

[00:19:39] Different, different.

[00:19:41] Yeah.

[00:19:42] Wow.

[00:19:42] Well, thank you for those tidbits, Jaden.

[00:19:46] It's just, it's so valuable talking with you.

[00:19:49] And I hope you know that our listeners and then Natalie and I just, you know, really appreciate

[00:19:55] you so, so much.

[00:19:56] And we're about to wrap up.

[00:19:59] So why don't you tell all of our listeners where they can find you after today's conversation?

[00:20:08] Yes.

[00:20:09] Yes.

[00:20:09] You can find me on LinkedIn, Jaden McCann, exactly how it's spelled on here.

[00:20:14] You can also email me at Jaden at jasperconsultancy.com or find us on our website, jasperconsultancy.com and reach out.

[00:20:22] I'm happy to make connections and help anybody and everybody that I can.

[00:20:27] Amazing, Jaden.

[00:20:28] Well, thank you again for your time.

[00:20:29] We appreciate you and we appreciate everyone for tuning in today.

[00:20:32] Can't wait to see you next time.

[00:20:35] Please like, share, subscribe, all the things on all the channels and we will see you next

[00:20:42] time.

[00:20:43] See ya.