California Schemin' From Paychecks to Prison: Unbelievable Scams Busted

[00:00:00] Brian, let me ask you a question. What's up? In the HR and payroll world that's filled with so many different systems, what advice would you give to someone who's looking to simplify things? That is a great question. And it makes me think of this time I was working for a consultant and it was crazy because all the clients had different systems. A lot of times like you can use one system for your clients, but no. So I was terrified. And the one system that really stood out to me was Bamboo HR. Made my life so much easier.

[00:00:29] Do what we did and get a free demo of BambooHR.com slash free demo. Get back to doing what you actually love in HR. Go to BambooHR.com slash free demo. That's BambooHR.com slash free demo. Welcome back folks. This is episode 51. It's about your paycheck. We're talking about some true crimes today, but before we get into it, how you doing, sir?

[00:00:58] I am doing good, brother. How about myself? I'm doing good, man. I'm doing good. Yeah. Sometimes it doesn't need to be all drawn out and long articulation or something. That's it. I'm good. That's it. I'm good. Thank God. It's for real.

[00:01:23] So what do we have today before we get into our main subject, which is a true pay crime, which what folks should not do at work? And if you do, this is what happens. But before we get into that, of course, we got some pay news, current event news, update type things. What you got for us today, Walt? I had something interesting that I did. Typically, I have an article, but I switched it up today. Yeah, I like it. I wanted to see what the top five employee motivators are.

[00:01:52] According to Google, right? And see if you can identify with any of these. Okay. Or you think someone could be switched out or whatever. And no particular order. Recognition and appreciation is up there for the top five. Having meaningful work with challenges. So people don't want to have meaningful work that challenges them. Career growth opportunities. A positive company culture. Yep. And competitive compensation with benefits. Yeah. Right.

[00:02:21] So do you feel as an employee, do you identify with any of those? Absolutely. Do those resonate with you? Yeah, all of them. And the interesting part is that, how can I say? Different people are motivated by different things, right? Me, my title doesn't matter as much as my compensation does.

[00:02:46] Managing people doesn't matter as much as being impactful does for me. Like, I want to add value. You know what I mean? And whatever that is, I'm happy with it. I happen to know how to do payroll. So that's where I usually find the value and data. And at this point in my career, I've been doing HRS for a long time as it fuels payroll, right?

[00:03:10] Because so folks, if you ever have a paycheck problem, it's usually something that's set up on your employee profile that messed up or just information that didn't get to the payroll person. Good. Anywho, that's me. What do you think? No, I agree with you. Look, like, I definitely want something meaningful to feel like I have a simple accomplishment. That's on brand for you, yeah.

[00:03:38] And I definitely want a positive work environment or culture. Definitely want to be paid competitively, right? Yep. And have those benefits. And I think in a nutshell, just want to feel valued, right? And I think that goes into the appreciation. Walt wants all five. He's like, I like all five and I want them equally.

[00:04:00] Look, I think that, look, I want to be able to have, I want to know that my work is being meaningful and making a difference, right? I don't want to just feel like I'm not doing anything and not making a difference in some way or impact in some way, right? And it was important for me. So I agree with all these top five, right? Being, like, look, it doesn't necessarily mean being in a position of leadership, right?

[00:04:30] No. If I was in a different position or a different role, but I was paid what I wanted to be paid, I wouldn't have a problem with that. Yep. Yep. And we can't mess leadership up. We can't mix leadership with managers. Just because you are a manager does not mean you are a leader. That's true. That's true. Just because you have people reporting to you doesn't mean you're a leader. Doesn't mean you are a leader. Yep.

[00:04:58] You could be the CEO and not be a leader. Yep. Yeah, that's dope. I like it. But mine is around the remote, my favorite topic, the remote work, to remote work or not to remote work. And this article will be in the show notes. It's from Coindesk.com. And it's about Binance. It's a newer company that's in the cryptocurrency space.

[00:05:25] And they are remote work first. They built their company around being a remote work first type of business. And the way they justify it is cryptocurrency is inherently global and decentralized. The crypto and Web3 industry operate around the clock with no single geographic or temporal center. It makes sense for it to be remote first. Right?

[00:05:54] Like is they threw some numbers in there. And they said a study by Stanford University revealed that remote work increases productivity by 13%. While reducing turnover rates and organizations save an average of $11,000 per employee annually. Wow. Come on now. That's a lot of savings.

[00:06:20] So remember how me and Walt and I are building a business here. And we always say if we get to the point where we could actually work for ourselves, I would want it to be a remote first business as well. And we always say, hey, we take the money that we save in commercial real estate and we get the company together once or twice a year on low cost somewhere and have that company. You know what I'm saying? And we do it at a new place every year, every time.

[00:06:49] It's in some somewhere different around the world. That's what you take that money. Because, yes, I do believe that there is value in getting together. Yes, there is. In person, the fellowship of it all. There's value in that. But it doesn't have to be every day. So that's my take on it. I love that they threw some good numbers in this article. It has a lot of good information in the article. But the numbers stood out to me. Nice.

[00:07:19] That was Binance, right? Binance. Okay. And they're a cryptocurrency. Cryptocurrency? Yeah. Nice. Okay. Yep. Nice. Before we get into the main topic today, let's pay some bills. Shout out to TimeTrackGo. And if you're an employee and you're tired of the paper and the messiness of whatever time solution you have, TimeTrackGo is an intuitive solution that makes managing employee hours and your timesheet, your clock in, simple and efficient.

[00:07:48] But don't take our word for it. Their customers have given TimeTrackGo a 4.7 out of five stars on Capterra. And they've been awarded best ease of use. So that's great for the employees, right? Trying to punch it in and out. And for the operators. And best customer support. Okay. That's good for you. As an employee, that's great for you. Because that means whoever you're going to reach out to has a good support. If you have any direct link to call them up, you're going to have customer support, right? But here's what some of the customers are saying.

[00:08:19] Great value. Best clocking app on the market. Great time clock for the modern office. It's intuitive and efficient. Simple to use. Priced right. And the customer support is awesome. Man, it's all good stuff there, man. Trying to have to talk to that though. To learn more about a simply better solution for time tracking, real-time reporting, PTO automation, and payroll integrations. And more. And look, you might mention this to your HR rep, your payroll rep, your job.

[00:08:49] You might get some kudos for this. Yep. You might want to learn more. So go visit www.timetrackgo.com. That's T-I-M-E-T-R-A-K-G-O.com. And start your 14-day free trial today. Let's go. All right, man. All right. We're going to get into it. We have a couple of different sections here. I think I'm going to start this one off.

[00:09:17] I'll do the overview and the key takeaways. And then Brian would do venture strategies and some warning signs for U.S. employees. Roger that. You know what I'm saying? Look, so this is a case about a wood framing company based in California. The title of this episode is called California Screamin'. Screamin'. Screamin'. California's scheming.

[00:09:44] And it involves a wood framing company that's based in California who was charged for felony theft and tax evasion. The company allegedly deprived its workers of their rightful earnings, resulting in a staggering $2.6 million loss. Dang. Both the employees in the state. So the company builds wood framing for projects like for hotels, apartments. Oh, so big, big, big projects.

[00:10:12] And they shorted workers. They're saying at least $40,000. Hey, everybody. I'm Lori Rudiman. What are you doing? Working? Nah. You're listening to a podcast about work, and that barely counts. So while you're at it, check out my show, Punk Rock HR, now on the Work Defined Network. We chat with smart people about work, power, politics, and money. Are we succeeding? Are we fixing work? Eh, probably not. Work still sucks.

[00:10:38] But tune in for some fun, a little nonsense, and a fresh take on how to fix work once and for all. Wow. So this occurred between the years of 2018 to 2022. The company's name was U.S. Framing West, and they hired unlicensed subcontractors and underreported payroll to the state employment development department.

[00:11:04] And the company was accused of grand theft, tax evasion, and prevailing wage theft, and filing false documents with the state. They also skipped personal income tax withholding and premiums for state unemployment and disability insurance. They filed false payroll records for workers on Veterans Village, which was the Cathedral City Project.

[00:11:29] So the facility opened in 2022 and offered 60 housing units and services for veterans. Look, they didn't do right with their veterans either. They built this community, but they were still stealing stuff from the people who built it for them. The complaint says that the company stole wages from 19 workers in Riverside County in 2021 and 2022.

[00:11:50] Under California's penal code, employers can face grand theft charges for stealing more than $950 in wages and tips from one employee, or a total of $2,350 from two or more employees within a year. That's it, right? That's it, right? That's $3.8 million. Yeah.

[00:12:11] So that was $40,000 per employee per year, count of 19 employees over four or five years or so. That brings you to the $2.6 million. Yep. Yep. Wow. And look, the impact of this was it impacted the employees, right? The wage theft directly impacts the employees' financial stability and their trust in their employer. And the legal consequences, enough said there.

[00:12:39] So, Brian, I'm going to pass it to you, man. Well, I'm just trying to – because it always makes you – damn, yeah. So this company was saving like $80,000 a month per – so $80,000 per month for all those employees. This is all estimates, just roundabout-ish. Maybe – I'm a little higher, so maybe $70,000, $75,000. But that's a lot of money, $70,000 in a month. Again, remember, they get caught on the temptation of it, right?

[00:13:09] They do it one month. Oh, wow, we saved $70,000 this month because we didn't do XYZ. This company was doing all sorts of stuff. What did it say? They hired unlicensed subcontractors. Yeah, unlicensed. That just – I don't know what it – what do you think, but it just means that – For me, that means they can probably get the job done. It doesn't mean it's going to be up to code or whatever. They'll get it done fast. You know, it may look nice, but –

[00:13:35] So then maybe – let's assume that – let's assume they did do it up to code. Okay. It means that they don't have to pay those people as much. True. They're not licensed. That's true. Right? Like, and on top of that, they're not – they're tax evading. Yeah. It's crazy. All right. Wow. So at least $70,000 a month that they – in all these little schemes that they were doing. Yep. Wow. That's crazy. Takeaways.

[00:14:05] Impact on employees. Wage theft directly affects them, right? We disinfect – some folks think, oh, we paid under the table. Right? They're getting paid cash or something like that. Oh, this is making cash money. Yeah, but you're not putting away for Social Security or Medicare later on. The whole argument about Social Security going away is not – is always – I've been hearing that rumor my whole entire life. That – you can't bank on that. You can't – that can't be the strategy. Why should I pay in?

[00:14:34] I'm not going to get it anyway. Yep. That can't be the strategy because let's say you get to retirement age and guess what? You haven't paid in a dollar. And I know people like – I know people that, you know, unfortunately have been under the table for their whole life. Yeah. And now they're in their 60s looking at retirement and realizing, oh, snap. Yep. I haven't put a dime into the Social Security system. I ain't getting jacked.

[00:15:03] Think about that, folks, as you – oh, I get this job. I got cash. I make cash. Even if it's part of it, we knew somebody that they got some money on the books and some money off. Yep. You still rob them from yourself. Unless you're going behind yourself and putting into an IRA. Then if you – That's a lot of pension. So let's qualify that.

[00:15:22] So if you're cash, at the very least, you need to be building a retirement fund for yourself in the form of some type of investing into something legitimate that will have some returns in the future. So no, it doesn't have to be Social Security system. And I do agree with – I think that people should have the option. Instead of putting into Social Security, you can – maybe if they let us take a percentage, the lion's share of it.

[00:15:51] Hey, yeah, we'll leave 10% in for the greater good. But I could take 90% of that Social Security, 90% of that 6.2% and invest it wherever I want. Yep. Yep. You know what I'm saying? And look, by the company doing something like this to you, not paying their taxes – because there's an employer match. There's a match. That's right. That's right. They should go too. Social Security. Yeah. They're robbing you twice. Twice. That's right. They're robbing you twice.

[00:16:20] Sorry about that. I get sidetracked. The other takeaway was legal consequences. Companies engaging in such practices face severe legal penalties, including fines, potential imprisonment. And as an employee, if your company is shady, guess what? Your company's not going to be around for a while. Yep. So hopefully, if you like your job, guess what? You're not going to have it for long. You know what I mean? So it's those shortcuts, bro. It doesn't – it does not pay off.

[00:16:49] Slow and steady wins the race. The shortcuts don't pay off. You have to – oh, thank you for sharing Myron Golden. Me and Walt swap Myron Golden videos all the time. Go look him up, okay? Yes. He is – he's the one that says that kind of rich, middle, poor type of mentalities and poor work to pay bills. When you got a poor mentality, all you're thinking about is I need enough money to pay my bills. Yep.

[00:17:18] When you're in a middle class mentality, you want to make enough money to have a good credit score and have great credit. Yep. But it's still just working to pay the bills, right? It's a – yeah, you may drive a nicer car and you may live in the house, but you're just working to pay bills. Whereas rich people make money to go out and put their money to work. Go look up Myron Golden, I think it is.

[00:17:42] And he has a ton of really great little bits of nuggets of advice to help you start to get a mindset around a better attitude with money. Recently, somebody in my family just told me, look, I'm not a risk taker. So I may never be rich, but I'm never going to be broke. Yep.

[00:18:04] So that's a good strategy to have because if you're not a risk taker, then yeah, you may not – if you're not a risk taker, you're never going to see the millions and the overflow because you got to take a risk at some point. Okay. Yeah. It all depends on how you view money, right? Yeah.

[00:18:23] Do you view money – and look, this may make sense to you or it may not, but how I qualify it in my head is do I view money as an asset or do I view it as a tool? Right. A tool for me, like almost a hammer and nail to secure stuff in place for myself. That's how I view it, right? See, for me, I look at tools as a way to make more money because I can go in the hammer and your nails in your house and make money. Hey, I'm going to try to do this.

[00:18:54] Right. Can you help me do that? Right. Or I could teach somebody how to do it. You know what I mean? Tools can help you make money. Yep. Anywho, those are the key takeaways from this article. Some of prevention strategies, this first set of prevention strategies is mainly for managers, right? If you're a manager and your job is to watch the cash register, then this is something for you. It's strict compliance. Adhere to wage and hour laws are crucial.

[00:19:23] Have regular audits. Updates and legal requirements can help maintain compliance. Transparent payroll practices. I was just fixing the company payroll and one of the pay rates, a premium rate is not showing where it should be. I'm like talking to the rep and the rep was like, oh, you wanted to show? I was like, yeah, it lacks transparency if you don't show it. People think they're not getting what they're owed.

[00:19:48] Please believe I bring these transparent practices to payroll every single day because my customer is my people, my friends and coworkers. My customers are my customers. So I want them to feel comfortable when they see their paycheck. They know, oh, everything's clear. I don't even got to ask Brian anything. Everything's clear. Regular training for your staff, for yourself, for your employees to understand how to read a paycheck, to understand what the little codings are.

[00:20:17] Some paychecks are restricted in how long the word can be, your earning code and descriptions and stuff like that. You don't want it too cryptic because then the employees are looking at their check and like, I don't know what this is. Am I getting paid? You don't want that. You want it to be. The point is, if you do have to use codes, you want to train them and give them some type of reference manual cheat sheet so that they can look it up. Oh, wait, let me go look up the line. Oh, I see. So what did we say?

[00:20:48] Education is empowering. That's right. So you're empowering them by educating and training them. Yep. And if you're one of the last things for as a manager and leadership, build a whistleblower policy where your employees could reach out to a third party. Not HR. This is the best one.

[00:21:09] Some people try to do it with HR, but you don't get a lot of anonymity unless you are able to reach outside of the company somehow and through a third party do it some way. Because a lot of folks will not tell on their coworker in risk of retaliation, being ostracized. Oh, man. You snitching. You snitching. Wherever you're from, that may be your code. And that's fine.

[00:21:38] But if you build a good anonymous thing, maybe that may work. And look, you may, as the manager, right? I know you may have employees that report to you. But maybe you're the one who's afraid because you're seeing something. You're noticing something in the trends and in the audience and stuff like that. As a manager, you're the one who has to say something. Yep. But you might be afraid. Yeah. Because you're like, no, I'm not going to ruffle any feathers. This is a good job. It's paying my bills. I can't afford anything.

[00:22:09] It's paying my bills. I would craft the message and give it to somebody outside of, like you, for instance. I would say, well, set up an email. Hi there. I'm Peter Zollman. I'm a co-host of the Inside Job Boards and Recruitment Marketplaces podcast. And I'm Steven Rothberg. And I guess that makes me the other co-host. Every other week, we're joined by guests from the world's leading job sites.

[00:22:38] Together, we analyze news about general niche and aggregator job board and recruitment marketplaces sites. Make sure you sign up and subscribe today. Not your regular email. Set up an email address for me from your crib, from the library around your way, and send this email to my job for me, to this person. Okay. You know what I mean? Because I can't. And if they really want to dig, IP addresses can be peeled off. Geography can be placed.

[00:23:08] I can go print something from the printer down the way. Or that. Or mail a letter and print it. Exactly. Go print it at FedEx. Somebody recently said Kinko's. And they were like, Kinko's used to be there because there ain't no more Kinko's. It's FedEx now. Took it over. But go print it out somewhere else. Put it in a mail. Exactly right. Do something anonymous. That's truly anonymous. And honestly, if it was, I would do something like that.

[00:23:35] And then, ooh, am I doing the last one too? Warnings for signs for employees? Yeah, yeah. Because I think you did. I did key takeaways. I think you did it again. Oh, did I? I think so. You can cut it out. You can cut it out too. You'll cut it out. Oh, damn. This is my editing. I can cut it out then. There you go. All right. Cool. And we're under time. All right. So, warning signs for, that's the Coquito. Sorry, folks. I wish I had. Oh, dang. See? See?

[00:24:05] Oh, man. I'm going to have to send you a bottle. Do you like it? Do you like coconut? Oh, yeah. Coquito, yeah. I know the consistency is eggnog. Yes. To me, it's better than eggnog. Way better. Yes, exactly. I do. Yeah, exactly. All right. Next year, I'm going to send you a bottle. So, the warning signs for employees, as it's about your paycheck. And this is, I love the, thank you so much for this, because this is really good. Warning signs for employees, unexplained deductions. Think about it. You got a big workforce. Yep.

[00:24:36] You take a dollar here, dollar, the building fund in your paycheck. Oh, don't worry. You signed it in when you did the handbook and the onboarding. Is this the building fund? There's a dollar from every check. Oh, it's going to, it's 1%. It's a back charge. Remember those uniforms, those shirts that you can put in? Yeah. Yeah. Remember when we did this at a field day? We just taking that back for this. Yeah. What? What?

[00:25:01] Now, see, employees, here's where this show is worth a million dollars, because anything that a company does in your paycheck, there's most likely requirements for you to sign off on it. Yep. So, by state, there are legalities that what can employees do, employers do to your paycheck. Yep. So, if you feel like there's unexplained deductions going on, you can absolutely, hey, can you send me the documentation for this? Can you send me the backup?

[00:25:31] I don't remember signing off on it. Where was it? And in most systems, a lot of, I'm not going to say most, but a lot of systems that are out there, if a change happens on your record, you should get a notification. Ooh, the sophisticated ones. Yes. The new. You make it as a notification. And if you see that, just don't ignore it. If you get a notification, you need to make a change. That's right. If you see the email come over, view it. Open it real quick. You have our email on our smart device. Yeah. Right?

[00:26:00] Our one devices. If it's cryptic, ask HR, ask payroll. What's this about? That notification that my profile was changed, but I don't see anything change. How do I find the question? It says I changed my taxes. It says it changed my taxes. It says it changed my taxes. It says it changed this. I changed that. Yes. I did. Yes. They could make up a, oh, New York implemented a new tax. Yeah, but how come it don't, and again, if you got deductions in your check, ask for the backup.

[00:26:27] Late payments, consistent delays in receiving wages can be a sign of underlying issues. If they have to wait a day or two for the cash hit, the way that check-ins and the savings. Don't cash it until next Friday. Not this Friday. I'll gladly pay you three burgers. Yeah. I'll pay you on Friday. You can have the burgers now. You can have the fries next week. Yeah. So that's not a good sign.

[00:26:55] And like Walt has done the research, those of us who get paid wrong more than one or two times are starting looking for a new job anyway. Folks are kind of hip to that. Oh, wait. Whoa. You messed my check up? I got to go. Lack of pay stubs. I can't even, what? I can't even believe that it would exist. You don't have a pay stub for record. First of all, it's illegal in most states. Okay.

[00:27:20] In a lot of states, it's illegal to not provide a pay stub. Okay. If you do not get a pay stub, ginormous red flag. Stop right there. You may want to start looking for a new job. What's up? There is something though. What? If you're in one of these states that it says in the United States, I just Googled it. And look, fact check us.

[00:27:48] This may be old, but this is what Google was saying. That in the United States, employers in nine states do not have to provide pay stubs to their employees. That's crazy. If you're in one of these states that I'm about to mention, these nine states. What is it? Alabama. Arkansas. Florida. Georgia. Louisiana. I see a trend. I see a trend. He's like the South.

[00:28:18] The South, basically. All right. Now, civil war was a long time ago, folks. Slavery is over. Holy cow. That's crazy. Yeah. Look. But that may be even still. Most employers in those states do give stubs either way. Oh, of course. If they're not, that should be a red flag. That should be a red flag. Like, wait. How are they even paying you?

[00:28:47] First of all, because it's like any system that they use is automatically generating a stub. Yes. Yep. Yes. Now, if they're paying you cash, then duh, you're not getting a stub. You know what I mean? If it's mom and pop in bodega and they're writing a check out of their checkbook, then yeah, you might not get a stub. You know what I mean? And then the last one. Is it the last one? Is unpaid overtime.

[00:29:16] Again, any of these or late or unexplained, right? That's a form of wage theft. They're not paying you overtime. And managers love to. I've seen Fortune 500 companies be like, I'm not paying overtime. I told them. And they still do it. Yes. If they do it, you have to pay it. And it's a coaching. You have to walk the door if they're not listening.

[00:29:42] And look, some of it is because of not because it's willful ignorance, right? It's because it's just they may just not know, right? A manager could be. I've had to explain as a payroll press professional, right? I had to explain to a manager who had been in their position for a long time. Hey, that's not how overtime works. It's not at your discretion. Yeah, because she was basically saying, oh, they were moving hours. This person didn't clock in, right?

[00:30:11] So I'm trying to avoid OT. So I'm going to put it not in this paper. I'm going to put it on the next pay period. They have less hours. Oh, my God. So I avoid having OT. It doesn't work like that. Those hours were worked in that previous period. And it impacted their pay and put them into OT eligibility. You have to pay them that. Remember, some states it's OT by the day. Yeah.

[00:30:40] You go over an eight-hour shift, you get OT. And not to drag this out here, but going back to the pay stub, look, there's a study by NELP. Nope. Nope. They said that 97% of employers who pay workers in cash did not provide the pay stub. You're getting paid in cash. Yeah. You know something shady. 97%. Exactly.

[00:31:08] Unless you're getting – unless you're like back in the day, I remember I used to work for Wall Bounds. And Wall Bounds would give us our check. But for a fee, we could give it right back and cash it. But you tear the stub off, right? And like my good boss, I had a boss that was a jerk. And the nice boss would do the right thing and take the stub off, give it back to you, cash a check. Boom.

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[00:32:47] And even if they cash a fee, you portion back, not the stub. Yeah. Good stuff, man. Good stuff. We also got some great resources that Walt procured for us for employees, Department of Labor, Employment Law Project, and California Labor Commission, just to name a few for some links here. There are resources for us, folks. There are ways where there's – what I learn, what I – how can I say?

[00:33:12] What becomes more true to me as I learn and do research, where there's a will, there's a way. Yeah. If you want something to change for yourself, you can absolutely do that. Yeah. And just go look. Right now, the resources are there for us. And anything that there is, if you've got a problem any faster than your life, there's probably some type of help out there for you. Yeah. Yeah. So, anywho, what's the question of the day? It's simple.

[00:33:39] Man, why do these kinds of crimes continue to happen, Brian? Temptation. Temptation. Temptation. Greed. Greed. Yep. I think it all goes back to temptation. Yeah. You greedy? Yep. You're going to be tempted real easy. Like we said – by the way, folks, we did two payroll – two pay true crimes this week. If you want to listen to more, go check the other episode out on It's About Payroll. And we talked – there's a lot of similar things, right?

[00:34:08] If you could have even started off in a very, oh, man, I just need this month. This is a bad – my family, medical, on some John Q shit, right? And I need this for my family, my son's medical, my daughter, whatever. And then next month you're like, wait, that was pretty easy. Nobody came a-looking for me. I'm going to do it again. And I'm going to do it again. And I'm going to do it again.

[00:34:29] And I think it's temptation plus the feeling of having – especially if you come from modest beginnings, right? If you come from a family that struggled and stuff like that, right, and you didn't have much, and then all of a sudden you're put in this position of power and influence or decision-making, and now you have access to all this cash, all this currency. It's just, wow. I mean, that's a million dollars right there.

[00:34:58] I can take half of that and not report to the IRS. You're still reporting. You're still reporting, so you feel like, oh, wow. But see, what people don't realize – and here's the thing, folks. Employees especially, if you're outside of the – me and Walt are seasoned payroll veterans over 40 years between the both of us. We know the calculations for it all. You're not hiding anything because we know this plus that, this times that is going to give you that. If you give us two parts of the equation, we will figure out the third.

[00:35:28] Because it's all math. It's all some type of rate. What state are you in? Here's that rate. Federal? Here's that rate. How much do you make? Here's that rate. It's all explainable. So you can't hide anything from the government because they're going to see the improportionate things. They're going to say, wait a minute. These guys got a lot of hours worked because you're not thinking to fix everything proportionately. Right?

[00:35:55] This is how these folks get caught because they don't know how to do it in a way that they wouldn't get caught. And guess what? Most payroll folks are too honest to do that. We value our work too much. There are a few of us out there in these true crimes that, again, get tempted. They do something. The ghost, whatever. But the government, the agencies, all of them are going to find it in an audit. And it may take – what did you say?

[00:36:23] It usually goes like 18 months before it's discovered. That's the average cycle. The average cycle. So that's all you got. 18 months to get away with – and not get away with it – to do it before you get caught. Right? It just comes down to that, man. It comes down to that temptation piece. And what do you think? You said it. Temptation of what? What was it? Temptation and that feeling of not having it. And all of a sudden – And now you got it. Think about it.

[00:36:52] When I first started, I remember I worked for FEMA. I'll tell – I'll be transparent here. And I want to be – you make it quick for the sake of time. But, like, I worked for FEMA, and I made the most money I had ever made. Oh, wow. I worked for FEMA at that time. Right? And so I was like, oh, my God. I had been making $10, $11, $12, $13 an hour even doing payroll. Different positions and stuff like that. For sure.

[00:37:20] And so I got this job, and I got like an $8 bump. Wow. $8 more. That's a lot of money back then, yeah. That's a lot of money back in early 2000. You know what I'm saying? So I made this money, and then – I just started – I started going out to eat lunch, and my lunch would be – my bill would be $20. But then I would leave a $20 tip. Damn. I thought in my head, oh, I got all this money. I burnt through it so fast that I didn't have anything left.

[00:37:49] Left. Oh, my God. And this is my – because we had seen a little bit of struggle growing up as a kid and as a family, right? Yep. We had seen some of that stuff, so now I have access to all this cash. I'm out here thinking that I need to spend it and not knowing that I should invest it, right? So it could be the same thing for these people. Yes.

[00:38:11] You know what we should do on the next episode of this because I wasn't able to think about what the next one should be is what are – what's rich? Oh. We should define rich, wealth, right? What are the levels? Mm-hmm. And I'm sure they're dollar amounts because I'm sure in chat, GBT will say rich is considered this or what the – let's define that. Let's define that. Let's define what rich and wealthy mean on the next episode. Let's do it, bro. Yeah. All right, folks. We love you. Bye.