Unmuted Podcast | Episode #68
Topic: The Truth Behind the Call: Why Reference Checks Still Matter in 2026
Guest: James Lord – Director at Refapp
Guest LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameswlord/
Guest Website: https://www.refapp.com/
Host: Jeff Waldman – Founder & HR Tech Evangelist at ScaleHR & SocialHRCamp
Episode Overview:
Hiring in 2026 is packed with AI tools, automated screening, skills assessments, and data dashboards. But amid all that technology, one thing hasn’t changed:
People still work with people.
Reference checks remain one of the few truly human-powered ways to understand how someone actually shows up at work, not their résumé version, not their interview persona, but their real patterns, habits, and impact on others.
The problem isn’t reference checks themselves.
The problem is how most organizations do them.
Rushed calls. Generic questions. Checkbox exercises designed to confirm what we already believe. When done this way, reference checks add little value. But when done properly, they can uncover red flags, validate strengths, and significantly reduce hiring risk.
In this episode, James Lord joins us to break down why reference checks still matter and how to do them right in a modern hiring environment.
We explore:
👉 Why reference checks remain critical in an AI-driven hiring landscape
👉 What reference checks reveal that interviews, assessments, and automation often miss
👉 Where most companies go wrong with their reference-checking process
👉 What a high-value, well-designed reference check actually looks like
👉 Real examples where reference checks meaningfully changed hiring decisions, for better or worse
If you’re hiring in 2026 and relying solely on automation, this episode is a timely reminder that some of the most important insights still come from real conversations with real people.
About James Lord:
James Lord, originally from the UK, based in Canada for the last 8 years, has a career in HRTech and WorkTech startups & scale-ups across 4 continents. He has a proven track record of building from zero and scaling globally. Loves creating transformative change and streamlining processes for his clients. Outside of work, you’ll find him running, in the gym, hiking mountains, riding motorbikes, or jetting off to new destinations.
📩 Contact James: james.lord@refapp.com
🔗 Connect on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jameswlord/
About ScaleHR
The Unmuted Podcast is powered by ScaleHR (https://goscalehr.com/), a rapidly growing company that supports emerging HR, Recruitment, and Work Tech startups and SMBs with brand awareness and lead generation.
Our proprietary solution, Catalyst, blends content strategy, influencer marketing, and omnichannel distribution to help brands cut through the noise.
📩 Connect with ScaleHR: https://www.goscalehr.com/
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