The Gen Z Content Creator Industry

[00:00:03] This is Hashtag Gen Z, a podcast that explores Generation Z, who they are, how they're different from other generations, while also being an incredible blend of those who came before them. We explore what they think is cool, what moves them, and why they do what they do. I'm your host, Megan Grace, and it's so nice to have you here. Welcome back. I'm so excited to dive into today's topic. This is truly a fascinating one that if you haven't been paying attention to it, it's probably just been happening around you, but it's important to keep some eyeballs on it.

[00:00:30] Over the past decade, influencer marketing has transformed from a niche strategy to a powerhouse industry. In Sprout Social's 2024 Influencer Marketing Report, it was positioned that influencer marketing was valued at roughly $1.7 billion back in 2016. But in 2024, it has skyrocketed to an impressive $24 billion industry.

[00:00:55] This exponential growth underscores how brands are increasingly leveraging influencers and content creators to authentically connect with their audiences. But it's not just the numbers. It's about the evolution of content creation itself. There's been a rise of user-generated content, including short-form videos and the integration of artificial intelligence that have allowed the creative process to allow more voices to be heard and stories to be shared.

[00:01:21] We think about the proliferation of different platforms like TikTok and Instagram that have become incubators for creativity, enabling people to turn passions into influential platforms. And it's something that is just truly a fascinating evolution over time. And so I wanted to talk with some people that have been at the heart of that evolution. In this episode, I'm joined by Jess Hunnishin, who is one of the co-founders of Shine Talent Group, Love X Money Ventures, and The Thread.

[00:01:49] Shine Talent Group is a globally recognized, award-winning, influencer talent management agency with hubs in Los Angeles, Toronto, London, and New York. It represents top creators across TikTok, Instagram, YouTube, and beyond. It collaborates with brands such as Amazon, Google, and Skims, just to name a few. In 2023, Jess and her business partner and co-founder, Emily Ward, launched Love X Money Ventures, an angel investment fund supporting startups in the creator economy and women's health spaces.

[00:02:18] They also developed The Thread, an innovative project management software for talent agencies. Together, Jess and Emily have continued to lead and innovate at the intersection of talent, technology, and entrepreneurship. So whether you're a budding creator, a brand strategist, or just curious about the digital landscapes that shape our culture, this conversation is packed with insights you won't want to miss. So let's dive in and welcome Jess to the conversation. All right, everybody, welcome back.

[00:02:48] I am very excited. I'm always excited to welcome a new friend to the conversation and really talk about a fascinating topic today. Jess, welcome. Let's chat and learn so much more about influencers and content creation. I know I have much to learn. So excited to have you here. I am equally as excited. So this is awesome. Let's chat. All right, Jess.

[00:03:09] So you and your business partner, Emily, do a lot of great work in helping with talent management and influencer spaces and content creation. But I want to rewind a little bit and let's actually talk more about, one, what it is that you do. But I always love to know the journey of how people got to the point of where they are. So give us the one to two minutes, skinny, on your quick journey into this work. Yeah. Em and I have such a nice business partner love story.

[00:03:38] So I'll give you a quickie version of it. But I had moved to Toronto, followed a boy. So silly. Reason for another whole podcast episode. So we won't elaborate there. But I had met Emily not long after I moved because my intention was to move to Toronto and work in PR. My background is in PR. I worked in PR and, like, television entertainment in Melbourne, where I'm from. And I just, like, anticipated that that's what I was going to do in Toronto.

[00:04:08] And after reaching out to, like, every PR agency really falling flat, I was like, okay, I need to do something completely different. And I guess PR is not for me in Toronto. And I decided I was going to switch my focus and be a wedding planner, which I had never done before. But I was like, yeah, I'll just do this. It's going to be great. So I researched all of the wedding planning companies in Toronto. And I found two that I really, really loved.

[00:04:36] And both of them I reached out to. One of them was like, you know what? I have all of the consultants that I need right now. But it sounds like you're much more suited to PR. Anyway, let me connect. I've passed your email on to my friend. I was very disenchanted with it at that point. I didn't think that that was going to go anywhere. But her friend was Emily, and she emailed me a couple of hours later. And we met, like, a few days after that. And at the time, Em was freelancing.

[00:05:06] She'd come from, like, big advertising agency background. She was freelancing after she'd had her two babies. And as any freelancer listening will know, when you have freelance work, you never want to say no to anything. You don't know when the next project is coming. You're like, what if I say no and then I don't get another job ever? And that's a really, really scary feeling.

[00:05:29] So like most freelancers, Em had just said yes to everything and then was, like, slightly overloaded. So I kind of popped in right at that time. And she was like, would you help me with some of these clients? And I said yes. And we started working together that day. And about four or five months later, we launched Shine PR, which was our first venture and boutique PR agency. And about six months into that, we're like, something is going on in the influencer space.

[00:05:59] This was 10 years ago. 10, 11 years ago almost. Something is going on here. And no one's really touching it in Canada. We were both in Toronto. And we're like, let's kind of explore if this could be something. And so later that year, we launched Shine Influences, which of course now is Shine Talent Group. And it took off very, very quickly.

[00:06:24] Our intention was that it was going to be a maybe this pays for, like, one very junior person's salary in some, like, magical world down the line. Like, that's what we thought. But it just took off really quickly. And it became our sole focus after, like, a year or two, I think. And then we let go of the PR side. And we've been influencer marketing and talent management ever since.

[00:06:52] That's such a – so many iterations of, like, right place, right time, right? So, like, if you hadn't followed, weirdly, the wrong guy, I assume, to Toronto, you would have been a whole world away, not even thinking about this. I think that a lot. It's like this weird butterfly effect. And that's why I always like to ask the journey because, like, I got into this work by accident. And sometimes the best accidents just lead us in really amazing places.

[00:07:18] Now, Jess, you talked about kind of getting into this influencer talent management content creation industry, right? Which, as we know it now, is just like this behemoth that even 10 years ago, you're like, this could be something. This could be nothing. Clearly, there has been a very big evolution in that space. And I feel like it's continually evolving. But can you walk us through that evolution?

[00:07:43] Because it feels like you have been around it since the beginning and really how the influencer content creation industry has changed, especially the media landscape as well. Totally. And I really do like to think that influencer relations is actually the oldest trick in the book. Like, I don't think it's so the format that we see it play out in now on social media, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, etc., etc.

[00:08:11] That is what's new and different. But really, influencer marketing, like, it's just the basic principles of brands trying to reach their audiences where they're at. And that was through television. It was through print. It was through outdoor activations, events, podcasts. It's through so many different things. And that's evolved over time.

[00:08:39] All of those things are still an element, I believe, of influencer marketing. We just kind of call it something different. But how we've seen it play out on socials very much started with the bloggers, like the OG bloggers, especially the mummy bloggers. Like, they kicked off this industry. And I think that's really cool. I love that this industry is, like, so dominated by women. But, yeah, so it kind of started there.

[00:09:07] And it was this idea of, like, this very authentic, natural, real endorsement of products from a trusted source. So people would read these blogs and be like, okay, like, I'm a mom or I'm into beauty or I'm into travel. And this person traveled to this place. And they kind of feel like me. So I think I'd really enjoy traveling to this place. And I'm going to follow the hotel recommendations and things like that.

[00:09:33] So it started in a very authentic way, which is an interesting and terribly overused word in this industry. But it really did start from that place of people wanting to kind of share their experiences. And that, of course, then we had Facebook and then we had Instagram and Twitter and TikTok, obviously, now.

[00:09:57] And I feel like that's it's just kind of evolved over time to be a really sustainable career for people. And, you know, I know we have talent who have been with us for a really long time but have been doing this for 10 plus years because they started with these, like, teeny tiny little blogs that they made themselves on their home computers. And that's kind of what they were.

[00:10:21] So it's obviously become, like, a lot more sophisticated now in how it all works. And that's, I think, partly because there's so much money behind this industry now. Like, every brand you see, a portion of their marketing budget is going to be going to influence the marketing now.

[00:10:40] And, yeah, it's been very fun for us to kind of, as you said, be around from, like, the very beginning of this iteration of it and to see kind of how it's changed over the time, over that time. I think that's such a great pivot into kind of my next question. But a moment on that, it's, like, a nod to women, right?

[00:11:04] Because, like, if women and mommy bloggers, which sometimes get a bad rap, like they do, really catapulted what some people would say is a whole other form of the economy and a global economy and, like, opening up business markets. It's, like, it's so interesting. And, like, I think that we need to put a little bit more respect on that name, that there were people that wanted to share knowledge because they truly did have that, in a true way, an authentic endorsement of something.

[00:11:34] Because when you're, like, oh, that person's like me and they like X, Y, and Z, you feel affirmed. And I think that there is this – we talk down about this idea of the mommy blogger. We talk down about it because it doesn't feel as intellectually or professionally rigorous when, in reality, I'm, like, money's money. This is America. Like, how you make it. So people don't care. And so I think that that's, like, a really – that's always kind of sat with me of, like, people are, like, oh, influencers don't have real jobs. I'm, like, I don't know.

[00:12:03] I feel like there's a lot of work that goes into it. Yeah. And I feel like there's a lot. If you're making, like, $500,000 a year, like, I think I'd choke that up as a real job. I would too. And it's, like, just because you don't have a traditional boss, a place that you have to go to work, you have to put on real clothes, doesn't make it any less than a job. So that's really a big question that I have.

[00:12:25] I mean, being a content creator, being an influencer is a lot more than just the fun posts and the product endorsements and all of that. Like, there's such a diversity of people that are online as well. From your experience, what do most people get wrong about the influencer and content creator market? Yeah. Well, I mean, I think exactly what you've just said, that it looks easy and fun and perhaps frivolous at times.

[00:12:51] I think that's kind of the general, you know, that's the general feeling that can be attributed to it. But where in reality, and again, like, both Emily and I and a lot of people on our team come from backgrounds in marketing, advertising, PR.

[00:13:06] So we're used to seeing, like, if you're producing a photo shoot for, let's say, a car, like if there's an advertisement for a car, you've got writers, directors, photographers, videographers, wardrobe, casting, hair and makeup, editing, post-production. Like, I could keep going, but I'm going to bore you. So, like, the list of that, of the people that are involved is endless there.

[00:13:33] Whereas if an agency is booking an influencer to shoot a car campaign, like, maybe there's a videographer. Maybe if they're hiring someone. But a lot of the time, like, they're doing from ideation to completion. Like, they are doing this on their own and then posting it to an audience that's already invested, dedicated, trusting, all of those things.

[00:13:58] So I think that's the biggest misconception is that, like, this is easy and it doesn't take much to do. And I think it's easy for people to look at it that way from the outside and be like, oh, you just, like, the amount of times I've heard, like, oh, it's just a selfie. I'm like, wow. I mean, it's really a little more than that, right? So that's kind of – and I think that, as we've touched on, it's an industry that is dominated by women.

[00:14:27] It was started by women, for sure. And I think there's just this kind of, I don't know, idea that for that reason it is frivolous. Like, we know that women's hobbies in general are looked at as frivolous by many people. And I think this kind of falls into that camp in some way, even though for a lot of people this doesn't only contribute to their household income.

[00:14:55] It is their household income entirely. And I don't know, I've always chosen to look at it as these are people who have started a personal brand and been able to monetize it to the point where they don't need to work a nine-to-five. And I think that is incredibly impressive. And the only thing that should be done with that is celebrated.

[00:15:22] So it's interesting to watch people think of it in different ways. And if you put it that way, of like these people, let's say, are pulling in hundreds of thousands of dollars a year. And they don't have to work their traditional nine-to-five. Everyone knows that, like, your girl was not built for a nine-to-five. I'm like a three-to-ten sometimes. Who knows? It just depends on the day and what I'm doing. But it's being pulled to the work that provides energy.

[00:15:49] And so, like, if these people are pulling in hundreds of thousands of dollars, which is way more than the median income in the United States, and they are able to support an entire family and spend more time with that family if they have a family or spend time with their loved ones, their pets, whatever it looks like, isn't that a healthier setup to some degree, right? Like, humans weren't actually built scientifically to work. That's just not what we were put on this earth to do. We've created all these industries. Sorry, I will get into that. That deep philosophical piece of it.

[00:16:19] There's two sides of that, right? So, like, you could say, oh, they're not working a traditional job. I was like, yeah, but they might actually be more present in some spaces of their life. Other people would say. But they're capturing content all the time. How present in their life are they actually? And I'm like, but that's the double-edged sword of anything in life. It is. There's, like, with anything, you get the pros and cons. And you kind of – you don't have to work a nine-to-five, but you do kind of work a 24-7, right? So that's, like, that's the tradeoff.

[00:16:48] But you do have, like, a different kind of flexibility. You absolutely have much more agency over your time and how you spend it. And so it's – yeah, there's ebbs and flows with that for sure. So we've talked a lot about, like, the mommy blogger and let's just say the OG influencers. That paved the way for, like, kind of the world that we live in today where there's a much greater diversity of ways that people influence and the ways in which they're creating content.

[00:17:18] But we've talked about kind of the work that a content creator or influencer, whatever term we want to use these days, operates. And there's, I think, some definite resonance with the Gen Z population. Can we talk a little bit more about how this type of work is resonating with a younger generation?

[00:17:38] And as they're looking at professional pursuits, whether that is being a content creator or the face of the influencing or just even in this industry and why it's really aligning with younger professionals and younger generations. Yeah. Well, like, two parts on that. One, I think that it's important to recognize that this industry – like, yes, like, what we see, what we see is the output of it is these content creators creating this content and sharing it. But there is this whole industry behind it. So Shine is a talent management agency.

[00:18:08] We have a team of 70 people, give or take, who are working in finance, marketing, casting, talent management, operations, like all of these things that are kind of connected to this industry. And I think that why that appeals – and, like, the vast majority of our team members are Gen Z.

[00:18:27] And I think why it appeals to them is because it kind of gives them an opportunity to be immersed in their roles in something that they're very connected to in their spare time. So there's not too much of a departure from, like, what I do at work to what I do at home, right?

[00:18:46] So, like, that's why I find a lot of people on our team are really so good at this job is because in their free time, like, they're very naturally just, like, casting new talent or thinking of ideas because they are spending their time scrolling TikTok or watching YouTube and things like that. So that's really interesting. I think that's why this kind of career path resonates with Gen Z.

[00:19:09] And in terms of being in front of the camera, why that resonates, I think it's, you know, kind of the things that we know about Gen Z. Like, I don't think they're built as much to kind of be sitting in an office nine to five. I think they're the first generation to really push back on that and say, like, you're – I'll speak to, like, my experience.

[00:19:37] And, like, I've always been in marketing and PR and things like that. And I always kind of felt a funny feeling of, like, I'm trying to be creative within the confines of a cubicle between nine to five, you know? And I always thought that was, like, a kind of funny thing where, like you, I'm, like, I'm, like, really good at working in the morning and I'm such a night owl. So, like, during the afternoons, I'm, like, eh, you could take or leave me at that time, right?

[00:20:02] But, like, I'm really good at these kind of particular times of day and that's when I find, like, I can be really creative and have, like, deeper thoughts. And I think where I felt that in my, like, early career, I feel like Gen Z has been the generation to really, like, push that and just be like, we're not doing that. So I feel like that's cool.

[00:20:25] They're, like, a generation that's going to, like, stand up and speak up for, like, what they believe in and they should, you know? I think that absolutely there's this element of, like, how would they use their time and, like, the resonance with what is, can some be considered a hobby, right? Like, social media and being online. Some people call it a hobby. And so, like, who wouldn't want to do something that they're passionate about?

[00:20:49] And I think the other piece of that people kind of get wrong about it is that a lot of social media is or creating content for social media leverages the tools that Gen Z was kind of, like, given. And they inherited and were raised to be able to use. And so they're just kind of leaning on the skill set that's really embedded in how they know how to navigate information. Yeah. They grew up online.

[00:21:16] Like, I feel like they came out of the womb with a cell phone. Like, they just know how to do it. Like, it's so instinctual for them. And that's, again, like, I feel like why these career paths, and I went off on a bit of a tangent for more of the flip side of the coin, but, like, for content creators who are Gen Z, like, this is how they communicate. Like, this is how they communicate with their peers. They also likely kind of finish school and or university through COVID.

[00:21:43] Like, everything they've done in their lives has been online. So, like, this is just such a natural way for them to connect. And I think to another point of that is in the research that we have done on Gen Z, when we talk about the things that are most influential, and you see this probably very presently and why I think, like, the influencer space has grown so much, is that this is a generation that deeply cares about word of mouth and people they can trust are more influential.

[00:22:12] And people would say, but there's, like, influencers and there's people online. How does that correlate? And it's because Gen Z is almost inundated with so much information, so much content, being sold everything all the time, that it's when they develop a relationship with someone online, even if it's a parasocial relationship like an influencer, it still does have resonance with them.

[00:22:39] And so even we're just talking about product selling or movements or grassroots organizing, it's those relationships that are developed. And it's just so natural to them that that's where they are gathering. And so it's kind of this weird dichotomy, right? Like, they're still talking to people, right? They're still talking to friends and family members about really important stuff. But there's still that interchange between the influencer and the person consuming the content, which I think is so interesting. They're so smart.

[00:23:09] Like, I feel like each generation gets smarter than the last. And they can just see through, like, marketing tactics, right? And, like, they're like, I'm not buying this. Like, I want to buy products that I feel connected to and potentially are cause-related. Like, I feel like the old marketing tricks don't resonate in the same way with them. That's for sure. No, and I think that you're absolutely right. Like, they see through it.

[00:23:37] And to that degree, they also have a filter on influencers that are just influencing, right? Like, if you're just, like, just hawking products, they know what kind of person you are. But if you're also someone that's providing them meaningful content and something that they care about, you can sprinkle that in a little bit. And I think that they understand the game. They understand the rules of the game. And they know how to tune into things that they do or they don't want. And I think that people don't give Gen Z enough credit for their BS filter and their

[00:24:06] ability to just, like, see through nonsense online. Yeah. I agree. It's impressive. I'm like, okay. Like, you're just going to say, like, no to this. I'm like, whew. Good for you. I like it. Yeah, exactly. Or just being like, it's not for me. I'm like, okay. So you've really been along for the ride with influencer and content creation, the market for a while. I know that you don't have a crystal ball.

[00:24:35] However, there's a lot of money in this space, as you mentioned, like a lot of money. Where do you see the future of content creation heading? And how do you kind of see this industry impacting work in the economy? It's such a great question. And you're right. I don't, unfortunately, have a crystal ball. But I think what we've seen in kind of the last couple of weeks with, like, TikTok is, like, a really important one to note.

[00:25:02] Because influencers and content creators have seen very quickly, like, what would happen if a platform was taken away? What would that mean for me? What does that mean for my audience? Do they know where to find me? How do I attach to them? So that's been really interesting to watch. So I think given that I'll call jump scare, I think people are going to realize that, like, okay, I need to connect with my audience in other ways.

[00:25:31] I think we're going to go back to see, obviously, we've seen a huge boom in Substack and email newsletters. And that kind of longer form written content, which love. I feel like we're coming in, like, blogs are back? Like, okay. And like any trends, like these things are cyclical, right? So I think watching that, I think we will come back around to very, like, owned platforms,

[00:25:58] whether it's, like, website, e-newsletter, Substack, kind of some kind of combination of that, I think is going to be really interesting. And I think brands will want to attach themselves to it and being able to, like, connect with audiences in that kind of, like, on another layer. Like, even on Instagram, seeing, like, broadcast channels and things like that, where it's like, okay, this is my, like, this is my core group of people. Like, that kind of thing.

[00:26:26] I think we'll see brands understanding what the value is to connect with, like, those people specifically. Like, the micro set within an audience, I think, will become very, very valuable. So I think that will be interesting to watch for sure. And then in general, like, we know this industry isn't going anywhere. We know that it's, I think, I think the number now that we're projecting is, like, 500 billion

[00:26:56] by 2026 or 2027. So it's, you know, we're not talking chump change here. So I think we're going to continue to see a rise in people wanting to become content creators. Like, I think that's going to continue throughout this next generation who have grown up with, like, their parents being immersed in social media from, like, their birth, basically.

[00:27:22] Um, so that would be interesting to watch people who kind of, like, already have these online fingerprints, right? Like, because, like, they will have, like, been, like, children of content creators and things like that. So it'll be interesting to see if we, if we get kind of that, like, multi-generational content creators through families will be a fun one to watch.

[00:27:45] Um, but yeah, I think economy wise, we continue, we will continue to see brands pour money into this space. Um, I think potentially, like, attaching influencers to live events as well. Again, talking about, like, finding ways to, um, to really get, like, deeper and deeper connections, um, where people are kind of like, oh, are you just an influencer? Do you actually like this product?

[00:28:14] Like, finding ways, um, to, to connect on a deeper level. And then lastly, I feel like we've seen the beginning of this, but I don't think it's been, um, it's, it's by no means reached its full potential yet. And that is influencers becoming very, very serious investors in the brands and companies that they are working with. So I think that that's going to be a big one.

[00:28:42] Um, we're starting to see a lot of that through love and money out, our venture fund, um, and brands wanting to connect with, with influencers in that way and have them like on their cap tables. And, and that's really interesting. So that will be, that will be cool to watch and see how that, that kind of grows over time. But I think that particularly in the next kind of like year to five years, we'll see, see a lot of.

[00:29:10] I think that there's one, you're giving us a lot of things to consider. I think something that I see as a lurk online is content creators also developing a little bit more autonomy to push back on like fair work. Right. And that's where some of the work that you all do in your talent management is making sure that the people that are generating this content that is so critical for marketing products, getting the word out, you name it, are being fairly compensated.

[00:29:38] Um, and are not just, uh, and more or less being taken advantage of. And that's something that I think is where in good way, right? Like if you're providing a good or service, like you should be compensated for that. And I think, um, I really think that we're going to, that's my prediction that we're going to see. And with Gen Z starting to move into more of that space of having control over their, their lives, right.

[00:30:07] Especially as they get older, um, advocating for themselves in that space as well. I, that's such a great point. And I think that will come for those reasons, as well as the bigger this industry gets and the more time that goes on, the more standardization we're going to see. And up until this point, there's just been so little, right? Like it's just kind of like people throw out costs willy nilly. It's, it's hard to, you know, attach it to any specific rhyme or reason.

[00:30:37] Um, so I think we'll start to see some more standardization, but yeah, in terms of like pushing back on costs, that's going to come alongside people being so, um, kind of locked into like what their niche is. And it's, it's what we advise talent of all the time is that don't be everything for everyone. Like you just don't need to be like pick, pick your lane, stay there. And that doesn't mean you can't deviate from it. It doesn't mean you can't evolve.

[00:31:06] Of course you can, but don't feel like you have to create content for the masses, like create for those niche groups, because then the brands who want to reach those people, like you're going to be amongst their only options. Right. So making sure that when you're a content creator, really, really honing in on that. And that also helps you to demand those strong paychecks. Yeah.

[00:31:36] It's, it's the specialization piece of it. I could talk about this forever, but I mean, I think it's the, it is, I feel like it's the wild west, um, to some degree in the wild west keeps changing. Like I know that there's the new laws that are coming out of like, if you are a parent influencer and you are not paying your child because your child is helping generate that content. I'm like, I can't even, I don't think that when we were thinking of building social media that we were going to get into that place of like, you now have to employ your child. Like it's wild.

[00:32:06] Um, but I, I do think that there is so much that is, and I think why I'm so interested in that there's so much that is going to impact the economy that Gen Z is engaging with to bring it back to them, but also how this impacts work and how this impacts, how they're navigating the world, how they're eventually going to become parents, how they will eventually manage their own households with this undercurrent of the influencer economy. Yeah. And I just think that's so fascinating.

[00:32:34] Um, I, I agree. And just like the, like the learning, like for me, I'm like not Gen Z, unfortunately, but it's like the learning that you get on social media. Like, I feel like it, like they're just going to be, they're already so smart, but they're just going to be so knowledgeable about all of these types of things that we didn't necessarily grow up talking about. And it's like how I feel like our generation, we talked about like, oh, we should have learned about this in school.

[00:33:03] We should have learned about mortgages and taxes and investing and all of these things. This is their school. Like that is where they will learn these things. And I feel like they're going to come into the workforce and into kind of later adulthood, just with like this unbelievable, like book of knowledge because of how much time they've spent online, which is just so incredible. Yeah.

[00:33:30] It's, I could not agree with you more that this generation is so much smarter in some ways. There's other ways, right? Every generation has their skills and their strengths, but they're so much smarter about things at a younger age than I could ever imagine myself. Like if you asked me at 18, like what a mortgage was, I'm like, I think it has to do with houses. I don't know. Not really sure. Not really my thing. I know now because I have one, but I think you're so correct in that this generation

[00:33:57] is coming in very self-taught and you can't put a value or you can't, in my opinion, you can't inspire the tenacity to be self-taught the way that Gen Z is. Like there is this mindset and grittiness of like, well, I'll just figure it out. And I've got so many tools and resources to do that. And that is one of those things where I think that employers have to realize that like some of this self-taught nature is so advantageous if you're going to eventually hire them or

[00:34:26] brands or whoever it is that's engaging with this generation. I want to spend a little bit of time talking directly to Gen Z because we do have some Gen Z listeners. What advice do you have for those who are in Gen Z and might be pursuing content creation as a career themselves or working in the industry and kind of being in some of these support roles or these management roles?

[00:34:51] Yeah, I think if you're going to the content creator space, as I said before, like hone in on your niche, know that that is going to be your absolute super strength. Don't focus solely on growth. It's like the last thing I think people should focus on. I think you should put all of your energy into value and like pushing continuous value to your audience, however big or small they are.

[00:35:20] It will result in growth, but it comes in a really different way. And that's the way that I personally like to see growth. So that's my feedback or advice, sorry, as a if you want to be a content creator. And then if you're coming in on the other side and kind of the talent management or more support role side, again, know that like your super strength is that you're Gen Z.

[00:35:47] And I was talking to a team member about this today because she was saying, you know, I think I'm going to get one of our more senior team members to join this casting call because I worry that they might think that like I look a bit young and inexperienced. And I was like, that's what's like, use that to sell yourself. Like you are young. So, you know, all of the trends, you know, what's going on, like utilize that, like be really creative in your approach

[00:36:15] and like show that you understand trends. Like I, it's so fun now when you see people do like TikToks and things like that, like as job applications. I'm like, that's awesome. Like, and I've always been a big believer that like you should show yourself in a job application, like show who you are. And like if the company doesn't go for it, that's such a blessing in disguise. It was not the right fit for you. This is a good thing.

[00:36:43] But if they pick up what you're putting down and are really into you, they're going to like, it's just going to be such a beautiful fit. Um, so I would say like, don't, don't shy away from any of those things that like are going to make you so valuable as a team member. Um, and yet really, really lean into like your youth and like the, the, the strengths that come along with that and, and being able to really understand and adopt trends very quickly.

[00:37:13] Yeah. Yeah. I think that Gen Z is so adaptable and people don't give them credit for that, but it's also this idea of like their humor is sometimes a little bit hard to decode. And that is also a skill. Understanding consumer humor is a skill, especially in the line of work that you do, like knowing what's funny, knowing what's entertaining, knowing what's going to keep the eyeballs on whatever that thing is that's being shared with the audience is so important.

[00:37:39] Um, the power of having the ability to captivate people's eyeballs to something I think is one of the most unspoken valuable skills in this world right now. And Gen Z's got it. They got it. I agree. And I think sometimes like you need to be aware that like you, you might have to show some examples, you know, like, like though that their Gen Z's will know that like something probably will work.

[00:38:05] Like know your audience and like, are you pitching this to like a 55 year old man who like doesn't, has never opened TikTok? You know what I mean? Like know that like if you're pitching an idea that is really cool and creative, like you might have to show like, see how like this brand did it and this, how it connected. And, and this is like how I believe it's going to like show, uh, you know, drive new consumers, audiences, members, whatever you're looking to do.

[00:38:33] Know that you might have to like stake your case a little bit and make your case, right? Like it's not just a, here's my idea, take it or leave it. Like understand that you, you're going to have to like put in a bit of work to help someone to see what you see. Um, but once you get them over the line, like you'll have them sold forever. So know that like putting in that bit of extra work at the beginning is, is probably going to pay off tenfold in the long run.

[00:39:01] Absolutely. Uh, well Jess, we've, we've both said that we are sadly not Gen Z. Um, I think sometimes you probably feel the same way of like spending a lot of time with Gen Z team members and Gen Z talent that you absorb some of their qualities in a good way. Like there's some things that I don't mind having, uh, being influenced or being in, uh, a little bit inspired by Gen Z, but what is your favorite thing about Gen Z and really the, the Gen Z that you get to work with?

[00:39:28] Yeah, I think I said something kind of similar to this in the beginning, but they are really not afraid to tell you what they want. And I admire that. I feel a little bit jealous of that ability if I'm being super honest. Um, because I feel like I'm like family in the millennial camp and it just like wasn't quite done that way.

[00:39:54] And so I, I had, there's certainly like a little bit of envy that's, that's attached to that. Um, but I, you know, especially in what we do, we negotiate for a living and as much as it can be like a little irksome sometimes.

[00:40:09] Sometimes they, they're going to push for what they want. And that's a quality that I value so highly in like the nature of what they actually do at shine. Um, so I can't, uh, can't be too perturbed when they, when they come back and, and push you on things.

[00:40:29] But it's, uh, I, I do, whilst it's, it can be a challenge for sure at times, I do think it's such an incredible quality. And it's something that I, I certainly wish I had more of throughout my career, but I, I definitely look to them for inspiration on that now for sure.

[00:40:49] Yeah. I think it's the tenacity to ask. Um, one time I had someone ask me, they're like, I think older generations are threatened by Gen Z. Why is that? I'm like, they just have the tenacity to ask the question that other generations felt like they had to wait 20 years to be able to ask. Yeah. Uh, so they're getting what they want earlier in life and it's kind of pissing everybody else off. Um, when in reality, like previous generations probably wanted those things too. We were just like, we'll wait our turn. We'll wait. It's fine. It's fine.

[00:41:17] Gen Z's like, this whole thing could be coming down tomorrow. I'm just going to ask now. Um, and I, I do, I appreciate that about them. They're like, let's not waste any time. Like they're still kind and generous, but like they're, they're kind of straight to the point and that's helpful sometimes. I agree. I love it. Wonderful. Well, Jess, it has been so fascinating. I could sit and talk about media and kind of the economy and this weird intersection that exists in the world of 2025. But thank you so much for being here, sharing a little bit more about what Shine does.

[00:41:46] And the work that you all have been doing for really a decade. So thank you for being here and sharing about the great work that y'all do and how you support, employ, um, and promote Gen Z. Thank you for having me. It's been a pleasure. I knew this conversation was going to be good, but y'all I could have talked about this for hours with Jess. There are a few key takeaways for me that really stuck out.

[00:42:11] First, influencer isn't some new trend. It's an evolution of something that's been around forever. It's word of mouth. Brands have always found ways to reach people where they are. And influencers are just a modern version of that. What started with bloggers has turned into a billion dollar industry and it's only going to grow. Second, let's put some respect on the name of content creators because the work is no joke. The idea that influencing is just taking a selfie couldn't be further from the truth.

[00:42:38] These are small business owners, production teams, and creative directors all rolled into one person. And yet, because this space is so heavily driven by women, people still dismiss it. But listen, when someone's out here making six figures or even more than that, doing what they love, that's a real job. And finally, this all connects so much to what Gen Z looks for. Whether they're the ones in front of the camera or behind the scenes in talent management, marketing, or finance, they're redefining what work looks like.

[00:43:06] They've grown up online and they can smell a fake endorsement from a mile away. But they're not afraid to demand fair pay for their work. And honestly, that's something we can all learn from. So a huge thank you to Jess for sharing her insights. If you'd like to keep up with the work of Jess, Emily, and the great work of Shine, head over to their website, shinetalentgroup.com. As always, thank you for tuning in. If this conversation resonated with you, be sure to share it with a friend so we can keep the conversation going.

[00:43:33] Rating and reviewing is also a wonderful way to help other people find hashtag Gen Z so they can learn along with us. The fun of Season 7 is really just starting to ramp up and there are more great conversations on the way. Subscribing is the best way to make sure you don't miss any new episodes when they become available. If you have a guest you'd like me to connect with or a topic you'd like to explore, I'm always open to learning more. There's a form on my website where you can share. You can find that information at meganmgrace.com slash podcast.

[00:44:02] You can also stay connected with me on Instagram and LinkedIn, where you can find me on the handle at meganmgrace. This episode was edited by Leah Kramer. The Gen Z are behind the scenes bringing this podcast to life. Thank you again for stopping by. Let's continue this conversation and we'll chat soon.